I was talking it over with my wife and she said to just buy it. I want it, but I just can’t make up my mind because I also want Walthers 130' Turntable and Roundhouse. It’s going to be months if not a year before I can install it, but I can run my COLA right now. I’m confused about this color issue. If I buy a new UP E8A 176-5316 & B 176-5352, are they going match?
We modelers are a funny lot - especially me. Back when I was an avid airplane photographer/modeler, there was a lot of discussion about the shade of grey that US Navy aircraft were painted in. It got pretty heated at times. I remember looking at a lineup of Navy F-4s at Miramar NAS one day and was shocked at how many shades of grey were represented on the real thing. Same thing with my trains. I really want all of the cars to be the exact same shade of paint - yet when I look at color photographs, there is usually an obvious difference in the shade of paint on many of the cars. In my book on UP Streamliners, I can see everything from a faded yellow to the orange tint that is represented on the new Kato cars - all on the same train. Its more prototypical for a train to be somewhat varied in shades of paint, but I want my cars all to be the same. If you want to see the problem the manufacturers face, just pick some railroad color and buy a bottle of the pre-mixed paint from each of the manufacturers. I'll bet they don't match either. Same thing with the add-on details. I like the added handrails that Centralia/Intermountain add on their passenger cars, even though I know that the Kato molded-on approach is probably more scale. Those Intermountain handrails must scale out to about 6 scale inchs in diameter - but I like them. I do wish that Kato would do something to highlight their molded on handrails. Just a faint touch of paint for shadow efffect would help. I could do it with a paint brush, but it takes a steady hand. Still, I'm really liking the new Kato set. If you are at all interested in passenger trains of the '50s, '60s and '70s, especially west of Chicago, then this set is a must-have. There are a few things I might change, but the quality is excellent, the detailing fine and accurate and, if you were trying to model these cars with brass sides and generic floor/roof kits, the Kato set is worth 3-4 times what they cost. Gerry
No doubt colors fade and paints from the same company sometimes vary. (Photos also shift colors depending on film) Usually the difference is subtle and not glaring. Seeing the two Kato releases next to each other is like being slapped in the face. Wow!
Very nice!!! I got my COLA unwrapped and running today and am very impressed. That "neon look" drumhead sign looks great. I think my favorite aspect of this release is that it's possibly the only prototypical example of a regular loco consist comprised of ABBA E units. Nothing screams passenger power like E units and leave it to the UP to stick with the E units (albeit at large quantity) rather than go the route of others like GN who gave up on the E's for the mountain routes. This is my first (and likely only) major UP purchase, but I'm glad I pulled the trigger. I'm looking forward to seeing what Kato cooks up next. Possibly the 20th Century Limited, but a prototypical NCL or Empire Builder would be my first choices.
This brings back some horrid memories of my least favorite college class (though I must admit I learned a lot).. Color and Design. Unfortunately for Kato, this is a perception issue that magnifies itself no matter what they/you/we do. Pick any two full size prototype UP Smoothsides and couple them next to each other, you'll darn near perceive they are the exact same color. Now take those exact cars and shrink them down to N Scale. WHOA CHRISTMAS! The fact that all cars in the same set match is good enough for me. Now I don't know how different they look compared to other releases, but remember color is a perception. As long as they both can pass for UP colors, that again is good enough for me. If you want to run them together though, I agree mismatched colors are distracting, but I think there are easy tricks with weathering one can do to help mask the color shift. Maybe the brighter set gets a light dusting of gray while the darker set gets white. Even very light weathering (to allow the appearance of an weathered set) should be able to aid in this.
This set runs on grey trucks, and IIRC, and will have to look to be sure ,all the other Kato releases have silver trucks. The yellow is oranger than past runs, but no two releases have ever matched each other, and UP yellow seems to be a color that even UP couldn't keep consistant from day to day, or shop to shop. Mixing cars from the other runs still works, for silver truck cars would have been painted at a different time/place, and would likely not have exactly matched anyway. As a UP modeler, I'm just used to it, I guess. MY PCM E7s are not too far off, a little lighter, but within reason, also running on grey trucks, bonus. PCM E8s siver trucks, color closer to last release from Kato Life Like E6s about the same, but again with grey trucks. Walthers cars are are in between this Kato release, and the last one, but also have grey trucks. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ao1pXlaog0s
Has anyone checked to see if the observation has the usual slot underneath for an FL12 function decoder to control the tail/backup lights on DCC? I notice the observation has a second light under the red marker light, is it a white backup light as on the Super Chief?
Yes, no backup light capability like what was on the Zephyr or the Super Chief. I was a little disappointed with that too. I will say even with the color issues, I am finding things to like about this set. I just wish Kato kept the same level of attention to details on this set as they did the other sets.
So to clear up whether the COLA set is a different shade of UP Armor Yellow, I just took a photo under daylight corrected lamps of the new Kato COLA dome and one of the original domes. The yellow has more of an orange tint, the interiors on the COLA units are brown as opposed to a light cream color and the trucks are a darker shade of grey. It also looks like the grey is a just a hair different, but I need to look at them one more time.
just for reference Kato Union Pacific Passenger Car Releases Item # Release Date Description 106-014 Dec 1992 6 car set bookcase Coach, diner, sleeper, baggage, rpo, observation 106-024 Dec 1992 4 car add on bookcase Coach, sleeper, baggage, dome 106-0813 June 1997 Business Car Cheyenne 106-0814 June 1997 Business Car St. Louis 106-1001 Dec 1998 A1 rpo, coach, diner, observation 106-1002 Dec 1998 A2 rpo, coach, diner, observation 106-1101 Dec 1998 B1 baggage, coach, dome, sleeper 106-1102 Dec 1998 B2 baggage, coach, dome, sleeper 106-1201 Feb 1999 Connections set C coach(SP), dome(WAB), sleeper(CNW), sleeper(PRR) 106-1301 Feb 1999 Connections set D Dome(SP), sleeper(PRR), sleeper(CNW), Sleeper(WAB) 106-5011 July 2004 A (2) baggage, sleeper, sleeper (COSF) 106-5012 July 2004 B (2) coach, coach(CNW) diner(WAB) 106-5013 July 2004 C (2) dome, rpo(CNW), observation 106-1054 April 2008 A baggage, coach, diner, dome 106-1055 April 2008 B rpo, sleeper, dome, observation 106-080 April 2011 City of Los Angeles 11 car set mail, dorm, (2) coach, dome chair, lounge, 10-6 sleeper, dome diner, 5 dbl sleeper, 11 dbl sleeper, dome observation
I just saw this video http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7z4kBzrz9BE&feature=feedlik and it reminded me of your Video. I also have Challenger and I liked the look of those yellow cars being pulled by it. I may do the same. I don’t know how prototypical it is, but I do like it.
Challengers did pull passenger trains, as well as fast freights, though I have no info if a challenger was ever assigned to a COLA, but that would fall under modeling rule #1, so go for it. Many of the car types included in the COLA set are in the Heritage Fleet today, and would be part of an excursion train pulled by the challenger. I think you'll like these too! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PaWXzFmlNIA http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0kA9gME5hR8 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U0TjJFMBQBs
Comparing the cars to the car diagrams and photos in Kratville's "The Union Pacific Streamliners", the cars are quite accurate. UP's cars simply did not have all of the cool gadgets on the roofs that many other roads had. Example: The UP used dry ice for their refrigerators, thus no ice hatches in the roofs. I expected to see smoke jacks on the dome diner, but there are none, and checking the car against the diagram and as built photos, that is correct. The only roof details are fresh air inlets. This leads to the question of where were the fumes and smoke from the kitchen exhausted? Was it pumped below the car to disperse it before it could make a mess on the dome? There is a small rectangular shape just in front of the dome on the dome lounge, which the car diagram identifies as an aerial. What difference there is between an "aerial" and an "antenna", as found on the 6203, is unknown to me. But that little rectangle while correct, is not as destinctive as the "antenna" on the CZ tail car. The only errors that I can find are all carried over from the cars that used previous tooling. The dome coach should have the same truck as the other two dome cars. The undercarriage of the 5401-5443 series coaches does not agree with the car diagram in the Kratville book. The spicer drive is on the wrong end of the car and where the air brake line triple valve is located on the model, there should be a squirrel cage compressor which is completely missing fron the model. As far as the color goes I do not know which or if either version is right or wrong. Hopefully Kato will make an add-on set that matches. The train needs several more cars to be realistic. At least one more baggage car, the previouly done Baggage-RPO, another coach, at least two more Budd "Pacific" series sleepers and another "Placid" series sleeper would be nice to flesh out the train to a more prototypic size.
The color differance doesn't look to be too bad. But after almost 20yrs of feeding us UP passenger equipment, why change the color now? I'd guess it's a sales gimmick to force us into buying more four packs when they come along and new E-units if one were to be that finicky about the color.
OK I’m convinced especially after seeing the Challenger pulling them, so I just placed my order. biggrin:
