Turnout or switch...you decide

mtntrainman May 25, 2020

  1. MK

    MK TrainBoard Member

    3,496
    4,798
    82
    How about a switchout or a turnitch? <ducks forcover>
     
    BarstowRick likes this.
  2. r_i_straw

    r_i_straw Mostly N Scale Staff Member

    22,210
    49,632
    253
    Part of my turnout key and lock collection.
    key.png
    And then there are all my turnout stands.
     
    Sepp K, MK and Hardcoaler like this.
  3. SOO MILW CNW

    SOO MILW CNW TrainBoard Supporter

    768
    111
    29
    It's a SWITCH!! . On the CNW back in 93-94, we called it a SWITCH, as in " throw the tower pocket switch so we can take beans" The tower pocket was a section of track that we would park the loco when we took beans, or tied up, or or started the trick.

    So it's a switch..not a turnout...( in best Arnold voice) lol

    Wyt
    But why do I hand lay a turnout, and throw a switch??? Lol. Everytime I throw switch..it never comes back...like a boomerang..lol
     
    BarstowRick and Hardcoaler like this.
  4. mtntrainman

    mtntrainman TrainBoard Supporter

    9,982
    10,821
    143
    Sooooooo...all us modelers who bought 'Turnouts' from msnufsctures should taake them all off our layouts and return them and tell them "I want to turn in these turnouts and swtich them for switches" ? :confused:
     
    ogre427 and BarstowRick like this.
  5. Dave1905

    Dave1905 TrainBoard Member

    265
    284
    22
    Prototype nomenclature:

    The switch the track structure that allows a track to diverge from another track. From the points to the frog.

    The turnout is the "curved" alignment of the track through the switch and then the reverse curve beyond to align the diverging track back parallel to the original track.

    In the rules, when they discuss operating something they are talking about "switches", when they discuss speeds through the diverging routes, they are talking about "turnouts". Both terms are used by the prototype, both are in the operating rules, but they are addressing different aspects of the same thing.
     
    acptulsa and TrinityJay like this.
  6. Jim Reising

    Jim Reising In Memoriam

    1,598
    758
    45
    On The Oakville Sub they're switches. Always have been and always will. Rule 1.
     
  7. mtntrainman

    mtntrainman TrainBoard Supporter

    9,982
    10,821
    143
    First and foremost...I appreciate everyones participation. I also appreciate everyone keeping the debate civil. Everyones opinions are valued.

    From those who have worked and those who still work for the 1:1 railroads I concede that 'The switch is thrown'. That being said this is from the 1:1 railroad CSX:

    https://www.csx.com/index.cfm/libra...nt/site-design-guidelines-and-specifications/


    H) TURNOUTS

    This section deals with turnouts constructed by industry or industry’s Contractor diverging from track owned and maintained by the industry. All turnout material shall be of no lighter rail section than the rail section from which it diverges (100# minimum) and shall be subject to the inspection and approval of CSXT. The minimum size of frog used in a turnout diverging from a sidetrack, shall not be less than a number 8. The type of switch and frog for each turnout to be constructed in CSXT owned track shall be in accordance with CSXT Standard Drawings. AREMA standard turnouts, of not less than number 8 frog size, may be used in industry owned tracks. As with rail, industry must provide material for AREMA standard turnouts when CSXT forces are needed for emergency repairs. Material for turnouts diverging from track owned and maintained by CSXT will be supplied by CSXT.

    Even CSX indicates that the whole assembly consists of a "Switch" along with other components that make up a complete "Turnout".


    From a company who builds 'Turnouts' for the 1:1 railroad:

    http://www.railroadfastenings.com/blog/railway-turnout-types.html

    Railway turnouts and crossovers, including switches, frogs, guard rails, stock rails, and closure rails; rail fastening assemblies unique to turnouts; and miscellaneous components associated with railway turnouts, including switch rods and gauge plates. Crossover tracks, double crossovers including the central crossing frogs or diamond area, and single and double slip switches are included in this category.

    ....the principal elements of a single turnout which consists of a frog, a switch, two guard rails, straight and curved closure rails, stock rails and switch stand. Switch rods, combination slide plates, braces and accessories may be varied to meet your specific trackage requirements.

    So...yes...Even though you are 'throwing a switch'. That 'switch' you throw is just one of many integral parts of a 'turnout' :whistle:
     
    BarstowRick likes this.
  8. John Moore

    John Moore TrainBoard Supporter

    13,396
    12,182
    183
    Well in my book all mechanisms used to activate a turnout are switches whether powered by electricity, hydraulics, air pressure, or by the old armstrong method. A turnout is the movable section of track activated by those methods of switching that turns the car or loco out onto another set of tracks. The 1 to 1 roads use either term to describe the whole shebang and cases can be made for roads using either term and sometimes both terms to describe the whole shebang. Thus on my railroad both terms get used for the same thing. An I don't care what that rabble rousing Mtntrainman says.:p:rolleyes::)
     
    TrinityJay likes this.
  9. BarstowRick

    BarstowRick TrainBoard Supporter

    9,511
    5,673
    147
    I just hate it when George puts on his thinking cap and starts (doing what else) thinking. Not that's he's wrong. He makes some valid points. Talk about frustrating, though. Aiiyiiyii :confused:

    The interesting thing is back when railroads were being first built in Europe and England the diverging route mechanism as a Whole was called a Turnout. As defined by the Engineering Colleges of the time. The Engineers that surveyed and plotted the railroads called them the "T" word. :cool:

    Even in America some of these same engineers came to the Rockies, to build the narrow gauge railroads. For example the Rio Grande Railroad and you can see on their plot plans they use the "T" word.

    However, the Rails (Railroad Employees) took up the vernacular of the "S" word. Throw the Switch, Align the Switch, move through the Switch all handled by what else a Turnout Man. No that can't be right! Of course it isn't, it's a "Switch-man". o_O

    It was a Prince of Model Railroading and a Model Railroad - wig wag (magazine) printed back in the 30's who called them the "T" word and for some odd reason it stuck. DA's abound.

    One more time: My family of Rails, never once used the "T" word. Using the "S" word. I'll follow that lead, if you don't mind.;)

    This debate will not die here. After all we don't want any confusion between a toggle switch and a track switch. Worst justification for the "T" word I've ever heard.:sick:

    Sometime in the late 50's. I even got laughed at by the MR crew when mom arranged for a long distance call so I could share with them. You know, what i learned from my family of Rails. What I heard in the background, "Some kid wants to straighten you guys out." Followed by laughter. Never mind what I thought and my internalized response, as a Kid. Respect lost is sometimes hard to retrieve. :(

    However, when (if you do) come to visit my model railroad they are "Switches". Don't even taunt me by calling them the dreaded "T" word. :mad:

    When an Architectural Engineer, friend of mine and I get together and talk about installing, a what? The "T" word is used in it's proper application as we are installing Turnouts. The whole mechanism. That's the only time you will hear it used on my layout.(y)

    Chuckling out loud. My dad used to read my Model Railroad - wig wags, and throw them down on the floor saying, "They don't know Railroading." Harrumph!

    Special thanks and recognition to my family of Rails, Great Granddad a Moffat Man, Granddad a Santa Fe Engineer, Dad an REA Agent, and Great Uncle a one time Conductor and played a role, with or as the Yard Master in Barstow, Ca. It was the time they spent with me, showing me on my layout... how to make up a train, switch the cars, work a switch job, bring a train in and much, much more. Times that will forever be appreciated and never forgotten.

    Then there's the friends I've developed Ron C. a conductor for BNSF, Chuck an Engineer for the Engineering Department for the Santa Fe, John A., a Architectural Engineer whose love for prototype railroads is the perfect environment for someone like me.;)

    More recently the guys at the Caldwell Model Railroad Club.
    Robert R., who loves prototype operations on his Z scale.
    Then there's George/Mtntrainman.:whistle:

    Who could ask for more?

    Remember, it's your Railroad and etc.

    Enjoy.
     
    Last edited: May 26, 2020
  10. BarstowRick

    BarstowRick TrainBoard Supporter

    9,511
    5,673
    147
    Russell those are Switch lock keys. I didn't think you'd, confuse the two.:p:D

    Switch stands, and only Turnout Stands, if you are in England or Europe and maybe some other places as well.

    I thought we left those places to do things our way. :sick::sneaky:
     
  11. Doug Gosha

    Doug Gosha TrainBoard Member

    3,595
    7,664
    80
    With my grandkids, it's "that track that lets trains go the other way."

    :D

    Doug
     
    MK and mtntrainman like this.
  12. mtntrainman

    mtntrainman TrainBoard Supporter

    9,982
    10,821
    143
    When an Architectural Engineer, friend of mine and I get together and talk about installing, a what? The "T" word is used in it's proper application as we are installing Turnouts. The whole mechanism. That's the only time you will hear it used on my layout.

    Sooooo once a 'turnout' is installed...its no longer a turnout ? It magically becomes a ......:confused:
     
  13. mtntrainman

    mtntrainman TrainBoard Supporter

    9,982
    10,821
    143
    John... "A turnout is the movable section of track activated by those methods of switching that turns the car or loco out onto another set of tracks."

    Have to repectfully disagree John..

    "A switch is the movable section of track activated by those methods of switching that turns the car or loco out onto another set of tracks."

    The frog, guard rails, stock rails, etc. dont move but...thy are all part of the 'turnout'.
    ;):sneaky::whistle::whistle:
     
    Last edited: May 26, 2020
  14. John Moore

    John Moore TrainBoard Supporter

    13,396
    12,182
    183
    When the movable section of track is put into motion all the other things get put into play and not until. So I stand by my first utterance.:p
     
  15. BNSF FAN

    BNSF FAN TrainBoard Supporter

    9,895
    29,174
    148
    While I know better than to ask a question in this thread, I simply can't stop myself so here we go.

    If I call it a switch, that means I can run my locomotive known as a switcher across it, right? So if I call it a turnout, does that mean I have to search for a locomotive known as a turnouter to run across it?

    :coffee::censored::sleep:

    Okay, okay, I'll go crawl back under my rock now...…..
     
    Carl Sowell likes this.
  16. r_i_straw

    r_i_straw Mostly N Scale Staff Member

    22,210
    49,632
    253
    I think I will just line the turnout to take the switch onto the siding.[​IMG]
     
    Carl Sowell and BNSF FAN like this.
  17. Carl Sowell

    Carl Sowell TrainBoard Supporter

    3,032
    8,078
    82
    When I was a young punk, back in the 40's, and needed "correction" my Mother would have me cut a long skinny branch off of a salt cedar bush in our backyard. That became her "switch" to "switch" my behind in hopes of changing the track I was on. OUCH!
     
    Joe Lovett, MK and mtntrainman like this.
  18. mtntrainman

    mtntrainman TrainBoard Supporter

    9,982
    10,821
    143
    "I think I will just line the turnout to take the switch onto the siding."


    Ummmmmm... I think I will just align the switch on the turnout to take the deverging route onto the siding.

    Just Sayin...:whistle::p
     
  19. mtntrainman

    mtntrainman TrainBoard Supporter

    9,982
    10,821
    143
    If you call something a Truss bridge...do you have to have a locomotive called a 'Bridger' to cross it ? HMMMMMmmmmmmmmm;):p:p:p:p:p
     
    BNSF FAN likes this.
  20. mtntrainman

    mtntrainman TrainBoard Supporter

    9,982
    10,821
    143
    But its not...only the switch moves..I stand by my utterance :p:p:p
     

Share This Page