Hi! Update from MT: After September's release, which is low profile only, MT will resume shipping both wheels. See the news at www.nscalesupply.com
Well, no matter which wheels you prefer one thing is perfectly clear: Micro Trains is listening. That fact alone will keep them high on my list.
The low pros will still come with the cars once things return to "normal" next month, right? It looks like a significant-enough segment of MT's market wants the old wheels to be included. I don't see how it is "progress" to deny them their choice. How does it hurt anyone if both styles of wheels are provided? Atlas still makes the International style cabooses both with MTs and with Rapidohs, don't they? Aren't the altenate draft gear box covers included so you can swap the couplers if you want to? Are my Atlas and Kato locos the only ones that came with a pair of Rapidohs in case I want them? (Taped to the underside of the nest on the Atlas locos.) How is that accomodation any different? I think it is sorta funny that the September releases with low profile wheels installed will be the "odd" ones for the forseeable future. (I don't think they will be "collectable" for that deviation from normal practice, however.) Perhaps MT will continue to install the low profile wheelset in October, and include the old wheels from then on? I think that would be a better compromise. There was a "WE WON!" topic on one of the other boards that started out with a "don't loose your sense of humor, "highrailers" comment. Then it points to the announcement and survey about the September cars not having "Pizza wheels" on N Scale Supply' site. By the time I saw the post, the N Scale Supply announcement had a red-lettered correction added. Why is that so big a deal? Golly, I didn't know this was a "contest" where we have to be divided up into "Winners" and "Losers". I thought it was a hobby where we each have the freedom to model or operate in whatever fashon makes us happy. Maybe I was wrong about that...... I guess flanges, rail height, couplers, and control methods makes entertaining "talk radio" for some people, but the infighting doesn't help the hobby grow, IMO. We might take a lesson from O Scale, where the "Two Rail" scalers always looked down their noses and took potshots at the highrailers. You had AC power, DC power, different voltage standards, insulated 2 rail, pure toy train tubular track with really deep flanges, toy train-compatible (GarGraves) inside 3rd rail flextrack and switches, and outside 3rd rail with "curb feelers" on the locos. Hmmmmmm.......I wonder what the market mix in 1:48 proportion is in the US today? My local hobby shop doesn't even bother to stock the 2-rail/DC versions, but they will be happy to order them in for you, at full list price. I've had 2 rail and 3 rail both, and I liked both, but for different reasons. We still have some of both, but it is the 3-rail stuff that gets set up under the tree for the holidays. Some of those are pre-WWII vintage, BTW. (Edited to add the thoughts about the percieved fragmentation of O Scale.) [ August 30, 2005, 08:06 PM: Message edited by: LongTrain ]
Sounds like everyone should be happy. The crusaders for the future wont like this but they can always use the LP wheels.
BALOU LINE has hit it on the head.. There will never be progress? What a load of Sow Chit.... have a look at the hobby in the last 5 yrs, let alone the last 20... [ August 30, 2005, 11:19 PM: Message edited by: virtual-bird ]
This is a continuing story that I hope to have straightened out by the time I release the September issue of the UMTRR. I'm in direct communication with MTL on this. Stay tuned...
It's kind of strange to me that this issue has become competitive. I guess it happens with golf balls and tennis racquets, among many other subjects. I use low-pros; I don't espouse them. I also have plenty of use for pizza cutters--my wheel yard is towards the back of the layout, where you really can't tell they are PCs. I'm also glad to give them away--a whole bunch will fit in a small envelope or box.
I don't see any problem here. The extra wheels should cost MTL NOTHING! How many times do I get a car home & find the wheelsets have popped out of the dimple & need to be reset? Does it cost Kato or Atlas or anybody else to include Rapidos in the box when Accumates are installed? Then we have a choice! I've seen many posts from modelers in Europe or other places that can't get MTL at every LHS. Let's face it, wheels & couplers are two items that should be universally available & compatible with the track you run on. All these plastic wheels are a big improvement over the shiny metal ones with the plastic inserts on the axles.
I can see now the entire September MTL offering being gobbled up by speculators because of their uniqueness being the only cars to come from MTL with the LoPros in the trucks and the pizza cutters in the box. I can see it on Ebay now.
That's an issue that perplexes me repeatedly. I have no problems with anyone wanting to 'advance' the hobby or anyone else who wants to stay with what they are familiar and accustomed to- for whatever reasons and in whatever fashion. The one thing that will raise my ire is when someone comes along and states how they feel it should be and then points to anyone not agreeing as 'holding the hobby back'? If the manufacturers are choosing to accomodate more than one camp then why should any of us take it upon ourselves to lobby to take a choice away? Am I the only one who deems this a manifestation of a lack of respect towards the very same people you share this hobby with? I might share with you how I like to enjoy the hobby but I'll never tell you how I think you should be doing it. It's a hobby- It's supposed to be fun, right? Don
I wish that they would include both kinds of wheels with their trucks. It irks me to buy a set of, say Andrews or National B1 trucks and then have to pay for wheels, too. It would probably be cheaper for them to provide both than to have seperate stock numbers and packaging as they do with the Bettendorf and rollerbearing trucks.
I guess this is one of the huge advantages of my limited vision. I can opt for either and not even notice. Life is good. In fact, I would like to use the wheel sets that will hold Kato track the best. Any suggestions? So far I have had the best results from Atlas and Kato. One of my current projects is designing a set of wood blocks more or less the shape of train cars to be painted by children and then have trucks mounted on them.
No Don, you are not the only one that feels that way. Whether you are talking about wheels, couplers, rail height, control methods, or level of fine detail, there is a divisive element within our hobby who continually seeks to discredit the efforts of anyone who would dare to model or operate differently. In the past 90 days, I have been called a "tinplater", a "highrailer", "an obsteperous old fool", and accused of "holding back progress in the hobby" with my choices. You would not believe the emails I get attacking me personally for my choices. I should start posting their emails on the boards so people can see how they act when they think nobody but me will see. One of the moderators (!) on the Railwire gleefully posts a monthly topic containing the spoof cover of an imaginary magazine called "Outcome-Based Toy Railroading" Here is a link: Toy Trains Actually, it is the arrogant types, who think their way is the only right way, who are holding back the growth of N Scale with their outspoken public disdain for the "average" guy or gal, with the "average layout", who gets a kick out of running their "average" trains. Shame on them! Live and let live, and the hobby will grow. Split us up into war camps like happened in O Scale with the "Q Scalers", Proto48, 2-rail scale, outside 3rd rail scale, 3-rail semi-scale Highrail, and outright tinplate, and we all lose clout with the manufacturers. In fact, most LHS only stock the highrail and toy train versions of "O Guage" trains, now. If you want 2-rail DC O Scale, it is a special order item most places. The same could happen in N Scale if the zealots don't back off. I think the Atlas Trainman line is an important indicator that Atlas realizes there is a growing market share that cannot be served with ever finer (and fragile) details. Kudos to Atlas for getting it right. I wonder if this philosophy comes over from the "separate company" that runs the Atlas O Scale venture? Shame on those arrogant few who would attempt to use a public forum to discredit the personal choices and honest efforts of any other hobbyist. Do what makes you happy with your own trains........just don't try to cram your choices down my throat! [ September 01, 2005, 09:52 AM: Message edited by: LongTrain ]
Bob, You should post them-I have done so with critical e-mails in the past, and the sender is usually never heard from again. However, I must say I find "Outcome-Based Toy Railroading" to be a hoot. (there are past issues over on the Railwire as well) Perhaps someone should prepare a companion "Rivet Counter's Illustrated" or some such, with articles like "Beyond Oversized Code 40 Rail" or "Real Modellers run Live Steam". Model Railroading IS fun after all, so what's wrong with making a little good-natured fun? [ September 01, 2005, 01:33 PM: Message edited by: rschaffter ]
Post the emails, LT. I think there a few people who are causing the most trouble. That's the way it works in most large groups. So by exposing the idiocy of these people, we'll weed them out, or make them change their ways. This hobby has no place for those who don't want to accept other peoples choices, and look down on us "average" modelers. At the same time, we need some humor. Please, I hope this isn't taken the wrong way, but this hobby is primarily older white males. There's a bit of obstinance that comes with older age, so we all need to get a good dose of humor, and laugh off some of the more ridiculous rantings of the unhinged. It'll do all of us some good. Oh, and I think everyone should be forced to run code 50, DCC, modern diesels. If you don't like it, then just leave! There's room for you in the toy scales.
Well, Thanks to those who reassured me that no matter what my personal choices are it shouldn't be too much to ask for a lil 'civility and understanding' by all. LT sums it up by pointing out that while we may all lobby for our desires it shouldn't be to the point of expressing disdain or derision to those who simply don't share our viewpoints. Ultimately when we express open contempt (on a public forum) toward anyone else within this hobby for their choices you have to wonder how many similarly minded folks are going to eventually sour upon such a negative atmosphere and perhaps choose something else to do with their leisure time and discretionary dollars- a most definate peril to the health of the hobby. Far fetched- not at all since sometimes these threads are read by younger hobbyists and here "we" are telling them that they're doing it "all wrong". Reminds me of once awhile ago when my youngest son was reading a RR forum and came back to me and said, "Daddy, some of those guys are mean". Nothing wrong with wanting 'better' at all. I often would fall within the camp of those asking for it but I'm not drawing battle lines to hold up any issue as a cause for further division among hobbyists. Mr. Speaker, I relinguish the podium to my esteemed colleagues..... Now what I'd like to know is since M/T sees fit to include both LoPros and the original wheelsets in their jewel cases, meaning two sets of wheels- can I just ask them to exchange the original wheelsets I would now be purchasing for another set of LoPros so that I can offset the money I've spent in the past buying their bulkpacks of LoPros when that was the only way to get 'em? Because even though I spent a fair amount of money on doing that, I never did finish converting my fleet? Bwahahahahahahah Don
Emails: The volume of hate mail began to drop off when I quit one of the larger forums and my posts promoting freedom of personal choices in the hobby likewise stopped appearing there in June. I still get a few, but I don't bother to answer them any more. I just hit the delete key. If I get any more like that after today, I will post them, though, and you can draw your own conclusions. The "Outcome-based" spoof thing isn't funny to me. It is probably because I am old, and it is probably a by-product of my "polite" Southern heritage, my Judeo-Christian upbringing and possibly a product of private school from 3rd grade through college, and the "preppie/Country Club society" lifestyle I lived until I went into the Army during the Vietnam war. Doggone it, right or wrong, I was taught that humor that ridicules anyone else's choices, appearance, heritage or beliefs was disrespectful and shameful. Sorry about that. (I can't explain why I felt compelled to apologize for what I just typed, but I did...) I do think I have a sense of humor left. I laugh and smile easily. I enjoy comedy to a point. I don't enjoy irreverance or ridicule, though. I'm not a fan of Mad Magazine, National Lampoon, Saturday Night Live, the Simpsons or the Family Guy cartoons. "Shock" comedy is just not funny to me. The outrageous behavior depicted would not have been tolerated in the polite society I grew up in. So, I don't read those magazines, and when those types of shows come on, I turn them off. If I go to a movie, and the content makes me uncomforatable, I leave. It is how I was taught to live. BTW, it does not make me "better" than anyone else, just different. [ September 01, 2005, 06:05 PM: Message edited by: LongTrain ]
