I have a 36' x 14' train room that I just finished stubbing in. I want to run the layout around the wall in certain sections. I would prefer not to have any legs on these sections of the layout. Has anyone ever cantilevered or "hung" a 24" to 36" wide bench work off of a wall?
I would discourage it unless you used steel and really know your engineering. I envison: It's a bad day and you are tired and not thinking Derailment far side of layout You reach across the to fix the matter. Trying to be careful you lean on the bench. Oooops
The Home Depot has 20" "monster brackets" that reportedly support up to 1000lbs per pair. I think these would be ok for the 24" deep shelf, but might hesitate on the 36" wide ones. If you do a light 1x4 frame with 2" styrofoam decking, the weight should not be an issue, even with scenery and track added. My only concern is that I don't know much about how strong the steel studs are versus wood. Once the wall is built (drywall, etc) it should be strong enough, but I am not 100% on that... Great idea though. Andrew
"You can do it!" Thats the way I built my layout... 24" wide all the way around... put legs on anything wider than that. Found shelving brackets, cut those in 2 so you have an L with a brace under it and built the bench work on top of that. I also ran a 2X4 on behind the bracketing and a 1x4 at the bottom behind the bracketing to give myself something to screw into, and not have to use 6" screws to go through the brackets themselves. Seemed to work nice if you have a stud finder. That is, if you finish the new room off before you build it like I did. Hope it goes well, hope I could give you some ideas, if you want photos or a drawing just ask. R.S.
Hi, I used KV steel brackets bought from Home Depot to install my shelf layout. They come in various sizes so you can pick the ones you need. If properly attatched to your wall they will support 900 lbs each and I doubt there is a layout around that weighs that much. Heres the link to some photos of the construction I used, http://www.railimages.com/gallery/bobhunt. Might give you an idea of how I did it. And keep your widest parts so you can easily reach them. BTW, I have stood on one of my 36" corner sections and I weigh about 200 lbs, the section didn't even flinch. I have 2 X 18" steel brackets under that corner. I used 5/8" plywood ripped into 2" strips to make the wooden framework and the plywood is on edge. It is strong enough to support a tank and plywood is extremely stable, not subject to large variations in temperature or humidity. I've had mine installed for about 4 years now and it hasn't moved 1/8" in a 25' run along one wall. Hope this helps you out. Bob
You can check out what we did on the RGW by going to this thread (post #10): http://www.trainboard.com/grapevine/showthread.php?t=86070 or to my website, link below in signature section, once there click "layout". Good luck with your progress. M
I'm planning building an around the walls layout that will be 32" deep in most places and extend out to 36" at the ends. I've been experimenting with different kinds of benchwork. Originally I was planning on mounting the back of the layout to the wall and placeing the front on legs. I built a section like this and was not happy with it. I built the benchwork level, and as the legs settled into the carpet (the room is already finished) the benchwork was no longer level. I started over mounting evrything to the wall. I have 2x2 supports under the benchwork at 45 degree angles coming out about 22" from the wall. So far I like this much better for several reasons. It should stay level. It's much easier to work underneath. It's sturdier - before if I was working underneath and bumped my head coming up it would knock the trains over but now it doesn't. I can lean on the front edge of the benchwork pretty heavily and and it supports me just fine. I haven't built any 36" out yet but I don't think it will be any problem, though I may move the 45 degree support out some more for these sections. I haven't taken any pictures yet but I can if you want to see waht I am doing.
That is exactly what I was thinking!!! Run a band around the wall attached to the studs and then use 2 x 2 braces at regular intervals to eliminate the front legs. I'd really like to see pictures if you can get them.
If you angle wood out from the wall I see no problem. engineering wise, it doesn't matter if the layout has legs that go straight down onto the floor or angle toward the wall. Sounds like a good plan to me.
Do not attach your band to the studs before drywalling/paneling/whatevering...the boxes formed by those sheets fastened the full lengths of the studs, and to the top and bottom plates is what gives the wall a lot of it's strength. Cover the studs first, then add the band, fastened through the covering, and into the studs.
Here is a picture of how I am supporting my layout(you can click on it to get a larger view): As you can probably tell, I am using hollow core doors on some of the layout, but the brackets should support any kind of benchwork. The lower horizontal piece is to support the staging yard below the main layout and is not needed for the main layout. On this bracket, the upper horizontal piece is cut short for clearance because the tracks coming from staging start climbing about 2 feet before this bracket, but on the other ones it is the full 32 inches. The shorter bracket here is not a problem because it is at the end of the door. I actually plan on replacing the top piece with better quality wood (like that used on the lower horizontal piece) but the design of the bracket will be the same. You can probably tell from the photo that the poor quality wood I used has already cupped some. The pillow case hanging from the bottom is just me testing out curtain locations. I've been spacing most of these at 32" - some are at 16" so that the ends of the doors are on a bracket - and they seem to be plenty strong enough. So far all I've been doing is experimenting with different ideas on the benchwork, layout height, and staging yard height. I think I have settled on what you see here, but if anyone has any thoughts or suggestions, I would love to hear them.
I think you've probably already figured out you can do what you would like to do. Essentially you are doing cantilever construction which many model railroaders have used for years. Your supports will just be angled back to the wall rather than straight down to the floor. In your planning, weight will not so much a factor as rigidity and ability to withstand tipping. This is determined not just by your support structure but by what you use to span the supports. If your supports are only 24 inches long and your train board is 36 inches, you have to have good support under the outer 12 inches and good attachment to the supports to keep the front edge from breaking off in an accident or tipping up if leaned on. If your supports are 48 inches apart rather than 16 inches, clearly the structure between the supports has to be more rigid. You undoubtedly have that figured out already. Go for it. I am a fan of lightweight but rigid construction. Most model railroads are way overbuilt structurally. You could indeed stand on them without a collapse, but my engines and cars (N scale) don't need that kind of support. However, if you are planning to do a live steam layout then...
I will be using steel benchwork for my expansion b ut do not have the nerves to extend to 36" without vertical support. One slip by one visitor or family member and you might be kicking yourself from here to Sunday.
You are exactly right. We finished the framing last night. When the whole basement is stubbed out, we are going to have a professional shhetrock company come in and do all of the walls and ceilings.
That is basically the bracing I am going to use. I think that it will afford more storage under the layout, easier access and no chance of someone "kicking" a leg. Great work. I think the pillow case is just the added touch you need. Me, I'm going with Sponge Bob curtains.
