This info was posted on another forum, but here goes. I will state at the outset I am primarily an N-scaler. However I have bought several Life-Like Proto 2000 undecorated locomotives lately to paint up and run on a friends layout. I have had several cracked axles on a couple of units, and have also found Walther's to be less than accepting of their responsibility in what I think could be termed a "Workmanship/quality parts failure". I am writing this to let my HO brethern know what has transpired. Upon discovering my broken axles, I called Walther's/Life-Like customer service and was greeted with resistance in their replacing these parts at their expense...even though the parts are obviously defective. I spoke to a rep. at their customer service department for a while, and upon deciding he was not going to make any decision to satisfy me, I asked for a Supervisor. Upon being handed off to the Customer Service supervisor, I knew I was in trouble. She was perfect for her job! She had 200 reasons why they would not replace the parts, despite stating "Look...we've sent out 20,000 replacement axles for free, and we're not going to send out any more!" I asked why it was if I called Atlas with so much as a cracked handrail, they sent it right out, yet since Walther's took over Life-Like, they have become unquestionably more difficult to deal with on such matters. "Well we're not Atlas!" ( to which I responded..."OBVIOUSLY!") The "Queen of Customer Service" then stated to me "If we'd known what Life-Like was like before we bought them, we wouldn't have bought them!" A less than "rousing endorcement for their newly acquired product line. Before a screaming match got out of control, I hung up and decided to e-mail the CEO of Walther's. His assistant did call me back on Monday and offered to replace the parts at no charge, waiving shipping fees...IF I SENT BACK THE CRACKED AXLES, AND PROOF I BOUGHT THE UNITS NEW AND WAS THE ORIGINAL OWNER. My questions are as follows: 1. How many of your keep receipts for all of your locomotives? 2. How many have had this now ledgendary "cracked axle" problem? 3. How many have had problems dealing with Walther's on such matters? My theory is if Walther's/Life-Like has replaced 20,000 axles, perhaps a recall is in order. Obviously this is a case of defective materials used in manufacturing or poor quality control on their part. Walther's stance is that they did not know that this problem exsisted with Life-Like locomotives, just as they did not know the Life-Like N-scale GP-38-2 which was marketed as"DCC READY", but was not. It is my contention that when one company buys another company, they presumably go through a process of due-dilligence to flesh out these issues. If you fail to do that thoroughly, you "reap what you sow". In other words...buy the company, buy the headaches with it. Walther's has decided that if you can't prove you are the original owner and produce a recipt for each engine with cracked axles...you're out of luck. I gather they would rather lose good customers and have a less than stellar reputation than to replace axles they sell for a 1.80USD/pair...and probably by for pay ten cents each. Every friend I have here in Toledo who uses Life-Like Proto 2000 engines have the same problems I am having. So I am putting out a call to all HO Scalers. If you believe Walther's/Life-Like should live up to fixing these defective axles at NO COST to the owner, then I would like to have you send me all of the cracked axles you have or get over the next 6 months. I will send ALL of the defective parts to Mr. Walther's personally, and in the meantime find out what our potential is to force a recall on the defective parts. My address is as follows: Greg Jones 1640 Gilbert Road Toledo, Ohio 43614 If I'm nuts, please say so, but I think Walther's is wrong on this point. They clearly have a problem they acquired with the purchase of Life-Like that they need to address and make good on all defective material/workmanship issues. I get nothing out of this, but am really irritated with Walther's as this is the second time this year they have tried to shed their responsibility in Customer Sevice for me. Let me know your thoughts! If you decide I'm nuts...I'll quietly go back to my n-scale layout and shut-up. Thank you for your time. Greg Jones Toledo, Ohio
I have about a dozen Proto2000 locomotives and I have heard the older runs of proto2000 locomotives (brown box vs. blue box) were more prone to gear/axle failures. An easy fix is to use the wheels from an Athearn locomotive you have on hand and are willing to use for parts. The athearn wheels/axles are a drop-in fit and work perfectly. I myself have only had to replace 2 axles on two seperate locomotives, and haven't had any other problems. The cracking issue has been known for a long time, practically since the first P2k locomotives came out. North West Short Line also makes a replacement kit for this purpose. I do know a gentleman who did directly contact Walthers and had no problems whatsoever.
We had severak P2K locomotives that developed cracked axles and contacted Walthers. The replaced all the axles with no questions asked or reciepts needed. The locomotives were GP9 GP20 and BL2. Five locomotives in all.
i had one axle issue each with a BL2 (old brown box) and a GP30 (blue box). I had parted out an athearn SDP40 and robbed it of a pair of wheel sets
I have roughly ten P2K locos. Of those, half are brown box. But I've been lucky (knock on wood), I've not had cracked axle problems yet. A friend however, has several locos that have experienced cracked axles including a GP18 and a GP30. The faults of this line are becoming legendary as we read in one train room after another, problems people are experiencing with P2K axles. I have to salute the gentlemen who mentioned dropping Athearn wheels in as replacements. I didn't know that was possible and the news is appreciated. I have several idle Athearn SDP's around that no longer run that will lose wheels if something happens to the axles on the P2Ks.
Hi group, i'm new to this group.... been into trains for a long time but stopped when family grew! Well i have over 50 Proto2000 and many c-liners proto1000. What are the signs of a broken axle or gears? I only have a small 18" wide by 7 feet yard i built to practice with my son so i cannot really run them a long time. I do have 2 that sort of hump up and down on the track but not sure if thats the problem or if they need oil. Can anyone help to clarify? Thanks a bunch! Sean CP rail fan and devoted HO scale guy!
That's a sure sign of cracked gears. I have a P2K GP30 (blue box) that had all 4 axle gears cracked. It shook and jumped so violently that it jumped the track. I took the axle gears from an old Athearn F7 and put them into the GP30. That fixed the problem.
Are the axles simply cut into 2 seperate pieces when broke? If that is the case, does anyone have a replacement part number from athern so i can get my hands on a few packs? I'll need to check all engines, because i have the full proto 2000 series in CP maroon and grey color scheams. I do want those engines to run as i have all diffrent road numbers and no spares! My proto 1000 series C-liners do not have this problem from what i can see so far. But how can they be broke, some enines have gone back and forth on the track once or twice to check if working correctly!
here you go 60024 LOCO DRIVE AXLE GEAR -(USED IN CURRENT PRODUCTION LOCOMOTIVES) 6 $2.25 http://www.horizonhobby.com/Products/Default.aspx?ProdID=ATH60024
Maybe a gear fracture, not the axle? I think in my case it didnt really have an axle problem, more than it was a gear problem. The gear on the axle split and caused the teeth to become mis-aligned, which in turn every time the drive gear in the actual gear casing hits that mis-aligned/cracked area and one gear tooth is forced to ride point-to-point over the tooth on the other gear which makes the locomotive "hop" as it goes down the rails. I don't have an axle in front of me, but I am under the impression that the gears are pressed onto the axles and the axles are just large enough to make the fit a tight one. Over time that fit may prove to be too tight and cause the plastic gear to bear the brunt of the outward forces of being presed onto the axle and eventually crack and disrupt the diameter and gear tooth pattern.
Wow. I have an P2K Geep9 that I purchased through the C&O Historical Society. I have about 9 or 10 total P2K engines. This one Geep jumps up and down as well. I have had the shell off, inspected it, run it slowly peering down in the drive w/ mag' glasses on, trying ANYTHING to find out what the problem is. I gave up on it and it sits in cabinet in my work shop doing nothing. I'll have to get that dude out again and really check the gears. Timely thread. ................ unfortunately.
I have opened up the drive system. I did fing 3 out of 4 axles cracked. But this is not causing the jumping around. I will try to put a little grease in there to get them rolling maybe a little smoother.....I have a lot of these proto 200 engines Gp9's, GP30's, GP7's Switcher etc... I am not to pleased to see they do not run well. I bought those to collect a few years back until i can build the layout. They all have less than 5 minutes run on them. Anyways, i tried to take the wole drive train out but no luck! Will try another time. I thank you guys for the link to the axle gears link, i will most definitely get me some odered asap. Quick question, can we swap the complete truck out with say, a Kato one or athern one? thanks a bunch folks, and glad to be back in the modeling world after a long sleep! Sean
Did you replace those three axle gears? That's the only thing I know of that will make it jump around like that. I've heard of it being done but never have I seen it.
Nope, have not changed anything. I cannot get the weight of the frame to have a good split up view of the trucks.
There's not a clip on the bottom of the truck? I was thinking the trucks for the GP9 were like those of the GP30. All I had to do on the 30 was to gently pop off the bottom clip and lift the wheel-sets right out.
This new attitude exibited by Walther's is quite a bad move on thier part. I agree with all that has been stated. I guess this is not just catching a Walther's rep on a bad day. Who cares if you warranteed 20k defective parts. Did they sell a total of this as a cuttoff- I doubt it. These parts cost peanuts to them. They will spend more on one advertisment than the entire cost of replacing each and every axle set in every "B" truck sold. So now they want to totally pi** off the entire HO modeling community and gain this bad PR and image? So this is thier "new policy". I have over 20 P2Ks, half of which are the ones usually plagued by the cracked gears. I have only had to change 8 axles in GP7 and 9. I didn't order replacements for every unit, I would just call for replacment if needed. I don't have receipts, and who cares if you weren't the origional owner. As much as I really do like the P2K line and would have continued to buy them, if this irresponsible policy continues I will be more than happy to buy Atlas, Stewart and even Athearn RTR and possibly more of the Spectrum. They have lost me as a customer and over simple pennies on thier part..... Before I make any rash decision, I will call for replacements for each and every unit. If this is the new policy, basically they will be recieving a letter as to my feelings and told they lost me as a buyer.
Well, I agree with you, BOGP40. P2K locomotives are well detailed and come off the shelf at a good price, which is why we bought them in the first place. I recall that as soon as Walthers took them over, the prices of their locomotives just shot up into the roof. I could hardly believe their new asking prices. Not only are they giving people heartburn over defective axles, but they're acting like they are trying to pull every dime out of the buyer to boot! Their locomotives "look" good but form over function never works in most modeler's books. While I did pick up two GP7's and hope against hope that they don't start "humping" down the track like those of so many of my friends, I know that eventually, they're going to need that Athearn wheel/axle set. One month in MR, there was an article of a group that was changing out P2K trucks/engines/drives with Stewart-Katos. Whomever that man is, he needs to get that business going right now. Shucks, even Kato could make a lot of money retrofitting P2K locos. Send your loco to a Kato rebuild shop and get it back, function equal to (or better than) form!
Well, I love my P2K engines and have quite a few... a quick look says about 40+ engines. I had stopped for a little bit collecting engines but am gettin gback into it now. I am looking for the replacement parts for my axles and will give a call to walthers shortly. I do not have a layout with the exception of a small switching yard so it`s not a real big deal now. But when the layout gets built, i want fonctional engines on the tracks! Hi also own Kato engines and my god, they are so smooth! I loved them! Anyways, i will let you folks know how things go once i contact walthers for some replacement axles. Thanks to all! Sean
Which item is this? I've trawled their online catalogues (horrible pdf pages) and can't find anything P2k, and it's not at all clear (to me) which 'Athearn' bits might do this.
Look up the replacement axle gears for the Athearn blue box F7. They're a drop-in replacement for many P2K axle gears.
