The Kato/ Digitrax is a good combination. We have several running on our club layout without any problems. They are extremely solid. I also only have an Atlas/ Lenz GP40 and a stock MP15/ Lenz and can honestly say that both run very well too. Not a thing wrong with Digitrax or Lenz, but my personal preference of decoder is Train Control Systems. Just as an aside, TCS is coming out with a drop in decoder for the Kato six axle units. Projected release is January '09. Given the smooth running characteristics of the Kato mech and the superb motor control of the TCS with auto BEMF, this should be an excellent combination. Just my $.02 Jim
kato/digitrax. there's no better combo on the market today. all my almost 100 kato sd40/sd40-2 are equipped with digitrax decoders. i wouldn't have 100 if they're not worth every cent. i have several dozens of atlas gp38. they're ok but need some fine tuning (aka bearden-modification). still far away from the performance of a kato drive. lenz decoders are crap (imho), i replaced all with digitrax ones.
So, I made my decision. This will be Kato SD40-2 then a switcher critter once the tracks are all laid down and operational. I admit my mind was already pretty much fixed on the Kato. Only the fact that Atlas offer decoder-equipped engines made me hesitate. I will get a Digitrax Zephir starter system too so it will fit all nice together. sandro schaer do you really have almost 100 engines? Did you convert an olympic swimming pool as a layout or something? :tb-shocked: This inspire me.. If I could afford to spend that kind of money into my hobby as well as enough room for it I'd model the entire trans-canadian line. From Halifax to Vancouver. The whole thing.. The Cap Rouge trestle near Quebec city and the Rockies pass would be the prominent features. At N scale, the trestle alone would be almost 21 foot long. All that linked together by the seamlessly endless AL-SA-MA wheat fields and various landmarks. Gotta dream you know...
Why? Everyone has been saying the Lenz decoders in Atlas diesels are no good but still no one has backed their opinion up with the reasons why they think this. I have several and see no reason to go to the unnecessary expense of replacing them.
I have about three Lenz-equipped locos and they have performed flawlessly. The LEDs seem a bit yellowish and I haven't tried anything exotic like speed matching, but they have always worked great right out of the box. Jamie
How about frequently dropping their settings when turning the power on to the layout? I'm constantly having to redo the speed table settings on most all my stock Lenz decoders. I have yet to have one of my Digitrax decoders fail like the Lenz do. Maybe this is a unique experience on my side, as I have only 3 kinds of decoders I use. Lenz stock in Atlas locos, Lenz 0511's and Digitrax DZ123's. The Lenz decoders are slowly being replace by the 123's. Virgule, good choice!:thumbs_up: -Mike
Maybe just dumb luck on my part but I've never had that happen, I have several factory equipped Atlas decoders and my hard wired decoder of choice these days where a TCS CN won't work is the Lenz Silver Mini. I'm not knocking Digitrax, just saying I have no issues with Lenz. I hope my Lenz decoders don't read this, maybe they don't know they're supposed to be no good, I wouldn't want them to find out.:tb-biggrin: Whatever decoders they use, kudos to Atlas for giving the option of DC or DCC equipped locos.
I wouldn't say they are junk but there are a couple of less than desirable features... I have a pair of RS11's with factory decoders. They run smoothly but were a complete bear to programme as they don't support three point speed curve setting. Each speed step is set one at a time (prior to using DecoderPro of course! err. And they are somewhat annoying with the ~2kHz buzz at low speed. Still, they do run smoothly. Are the latest versions the same? I optioned my MP15DC with a TCS decoder rather than factory and added an operational rotary beacon.
Go for the Kato SD40-2, I have a number of them (nine in all) and they are well made and good runners. Cheers,
About the lenz decoders, lets put it this way. You pay a premium for a decoder equipped engine from Atlas so you expect to get a premium decoder. The lenz decoders you get are as basic as you can get and are comparable to decoders from 10 years ago. Lets compare at N Scale Supply: ATL-47527-Atlas N Master Diesel GP30 Powered without Decoder -- Burlington Northern (GP39M) #2815: $99.95 ATL-47409-Atlas N Master Diesel GP30 Powered, DCC Equipped -- Burlington Northern (GP39M) #2815: $134.95 DIG-DN163A2 Digital Mobile decoder for Atlas GP30: $29.79 Not a huge difference if the Lenz decoder was comparable but it's not so it is a huge difference between what you pay for and what you get.
as mavrick said, the factory installed lenz decoder are basic. also they tend to loose their settings. as far as i remember no emf and slow speed is rather poor. digitrax dn163a0 are far smoother. of course this is strictly my opinion and experience.
Probably too late to chime in, but I would strongly recommend the Atlas. ...or a different Kato, such as an SD70MAC (if you want to stick with BNSF). Why? Because that particularly Kato is an unusual design and this is your first N scale loco, I would recommend buying a loco that will allow you to familiarize yourself with the standard Atlas/Kato split frame design. As you get yourself deeper into the hobby, you'll realize that taking apart and repairing locos is an inevitable part of the hobby. I'd suggest that your first loco should be one that would give you a good intro to that process. The 'mid production' SD40-2 isn't good for that, IMHO. It's a somewhat malfunction-prone design in my experience, and it has several quirks that can throw you for a loop if you're not familiar with how N scale locos are "supposed" to behave, or even if you are. If you do get/have already gotten the SD40-2, be sure to read Kato's page on disassembly.
It's not too late: An unfortunate handling incident destroyed a pair of 2" 4x8 foam boards and lightly damaged a 36x80 HCD. While technically not a big loss, I can't haul these parts myself as they don't fit in my puny Mazda sedan. I need to use their delivery service which is $50 per run. That set me back about CAD $160. :tb-hissyfit: Meanwhile I'll finish building the supporting trestles and imagine myself operating trains by making sounds with my mouth.
Ouch!.. If they are charging you 50 bucks to deliver something and they break it along the way.. I'd be chewing someone out right about now and demanding a full refund for the delivery or at least make them go back and deliver it right at no extra cost!
ditto.... but It's all my fault:tb-mad: It's embarrassing. Have you ever seen a dog trying to enter his little house with too long a stick for the entrance? Then pushing harder because it's "resisting"?.. That's me with the foam sheets, just replace "entrance" with "corner clearance". Then I kicked the door. They really are hollow.:tb-embarrassed:
Don't want to derail this thread, but since someone brought up minimum radius I was wondering, what minimum radius would you need to MU 2 or 3 of those Kato SD40's? Does it take more radius to MU 2 or 3 units than run a single?
Good question. I asked Kato directly and they said all their locos can take 9 3/4" radius except the longest ones, like SD80/90MAC which need 11" minimum. I don't know about MU. I have no doubt 9 3/4" is too tight for that. Im guessing the couplers would be the culprit.
Thanks and if anyone knows about the MU part, let me know cause I'd like to buy 2 or 3. I originally had thoiught I was going with a double track kato main of 13-3/4 and 12-5/8. I have made some adjustments to my thinking LOL, and am thinking of making the 15" w/ 13-3/4 inner work. I wanted to use 28-1/4 as an easement going into the curves and I'm not 100% sure I can make that fit with the 15". If I get creative with scenery maybe I won't need to ease the 15". Sorry for rambling and hijacking! I thought maybe my question would benefit the OP as well.
Depends on your use. Heavy Trains(lots of cars) go with a six axle SD40-2/Kato, Cadillac of N-scale and more expensive Needs bigger curves. Lighter every day freight trains(few cars) go with the 4 axle or the GP 38-2 Atlas is the Ford of N-scale and alittle cheaper Needs less radius curves. Just an Idea BOTH are EXCELLENT choices
