Why no dummy (unpowered) locos in N scale?

bigford Jan 1, 2009

  1. Triplex

    Triplex TrainBoard Member

    3,214
    1
    44
    I saved this, which was posted on TrainBoard a couple years back, but didn't note who wrote it.
     
  2. subwayaz

    subwayaz TrainBoard Member

    3,222
    106
    44
    Dummy Locos

    Bachmann has some sets that come 1 powered, 1 dummy, 1 caboose. Also Con COr had some not long ago and or you could buy a rolling chassis from them and a body then build your Dummies.
    Cost would be bad either about $13 frame, Body $6.00, trucks(pr) $8.00
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Jan 3, 2009
  3. davidone

    davidone TrainBoard Member

    368
    2
    13
    I was just wondering why the mfgs. of diesels don't offer dummys (unpowered). I know i would buy some. I know BLI offers dummy A&B units with thier hood diesels but nobody else does. What are your thoughts?

    Dave
     
  4. Stourbridge Lion

    Stourbridge Lion TrainBoard Supporter

    16,680
    130
    184
    I know that Con-Cor offers PA/PB Dummys as I have a couple in my collection...

    :tb-nerd: :tb-nerd: :tb-nerd: :tb-nerd:​
     
  5. David Leonard

    David Leonard TrainBoard Member

    548
    3
    20
    Probably because there are too few people who would buy them. For me, dummy units are useless, since most powered units don't pull well enough to begin with.
     
  6. SteamDonkey74

    SteamDonkey74 TrainBoard Supporter

    7,160
    171
    90
    I have a LL PB dummy.

    It could be that they're not considered all that useful with our scale's need for actual pulling power. I bought a dummy in hopes of adding sound to it. I haven't done that yet.
     
  7. Tudor

    Tudor TrainBoard Member

    1,747
    18
    32
    there are some.. but what they up there said. Many locos have a hard enough time pulling decent trains, let alone a dead leg locomotive. If ya wanna consist them up, why not power them to earn their keep?
    :tb-confused:
     
  8. eric220

    eric220 TrainBoard Member

    338
    11
    18
    I think the best argument for dummy locos is to have a place to add sound in diesels without the need to make modifications to the frame or mechanism. I know I'm looking at gutting a few to make room for sound modules, and it's really frustrating to buy a $150+ locomotive, just to rip everything out of it. Obviously not everyone's cup of tea, but I'm sure that there's enough of a market out there to justify making them.
     
  9. Hoochrunners

    Hoochrunners TrainBoard Member

    285
    6
    20
    Just a quick thought. Would the price point of a dummy be so high that you might as well spend the extra few bucks to get one that actually can do some pulling for you?
     
  10. Tudor

    Tudor TrainBoard Member

    1,747
    18
    32
    With the prices of some to the higher end stuff is hitting, I would think not. But he does make a point, the people that are doing that are typically not the novices, or beginers, and buy the higher end stuff anyway. It really wouldn't be that big of a leap to make them really. The shell would be the same, but with a stripped down or even an empty plastic chassis. Same truck tooling with the gear drives removed. It wouldn't be that huge of a market, but also wouldn't be that much for them to offer one on the side for those that want to do as stated above. But just to put on in to have two locomotives to me don't make since, because if you are pulling a train that would require two heads, you would need power anyway. I mean, it would look kind of dumb for a double header to pull a 6 car train IMHO..


    But all that said, it wouldn't be difficult to buy a shell, and even trucks from the parts dept and just make a bare styrien chassis either..




     
  11. Gats

    Gats TrainBoard Member

    4,122
    23
    59
  12. Fotheringill

    Fotheringill TrainBoard Member

    5,982
    0
    74
    I have a 30 year old GM Demonstrator "Cow" and "Calf". One is powered, one is not. They were purchased 30 years ago, BTW. So, I have a matching engine and dummy with original Rapido couplers replaced with MT's.

    As to why? Assume a run of the mill diesel costs $50. A dummy is going to have to go for $25. The dummy is going to weigh a lot more than two boxcars. Do you want to pull two less cars, at least?
     
  13. jnevis

    jnevis TrainBoard Supporter

    467
    70
    11
    On that I was browsing eBay and there is someone selling a pair of Atlas SD60Ms with the drive gear removed. I just scratched my head.

    I have thought about building a museum or loco rebuilder and really don't want an entire unit. That said I also don't want a pile of parts if I can only find complete ones either. Tudor is right on that, the shells aren't that expensive, at least Atlas ones. and a couple other parts and styrene bits and I'm in business. The ones that Atlas doesn't make that I want are easy enough to get on eBay from BMan or basket cases for nothing. Those I'd be fine with ripping the guts out of.
     
  14. dstuard

    dstuard TrainBoard Member

    981
    1
    20
    Consider that most N-scale locos use a split frame design and are as heavy as they can get, leaving only room for the motor and drive gears (and now, decoders). You would want a dummy to be as light as possible, leaving ample room for a sound decoder and big honkin' speaker. This would mean an entirely different chassis/frame, possibly with a new power pickup and delivery scheme. That's a lot of $ in development for a small market.

    As stated above, that makes little sense, especially when most lashups are 2 locos minimum, and you need both of 'em powered just to get out of the yard with any decent train.
     
  15. MP333

    MP333 TrainBoard Supporter

    2,704
    208
    48
    The majority of the cost is in the shell. The mechanism is relatively cheap.
     
  16. rush2ny

    rush2ny TrainBoard Member

    1,563
    3
    33
    I believe that the reason that dummy units were offered in the first place was that you could rarely run 2 powered units in sync with each other back in the old DC days. One was always faster than the other and usually caused problems.

    As technologies changed it became a lot easier to MU 2 locos (both in DC and DCC) and thereby made dummies extinct (with the exception of myself ,of course!) :)

    Russ
     
  17. YoHo

    YoHo TrainBoard Supporter

    5,508
    2,011
    98
    I got linked to this post from a newer thread and it begs a question, why is this not true for the economics of an HO loco? Or at least for the old BB.

    A dummy unit is significantly cheaper than the powered and I would argue that the smaller size and tighter quarters says that the motor and frame would be even more expensive as compared to an HO unit.
     
  18. YoHo

    YoHo TrainBoard Supporter

    5,508
    2,011
    98
    As I just posted in the other thread, this doesn't appear to be true in the HO world where Athearn offered dummy Blue Box units for significantly less than their powered units. $20 compared to $40-$45.

    Granted the shells were much lower cost...and I'd argue the frame and drivetrain on an N-scale unit is more expensive.
     
  19. Stourbridge Lion

    Stourbridge Lion TrainBoard Supporter

    16,680
    130
    184
    Maybe this is just me being naive (no layout to know any better yet), put the ones I have are desgined set for a ABBA passenger train. With 2 being powered (DC) and 2 as dummy's do I truely need 4 powered units just to pull my passenger train around the track? If I ever get to DCC (or whatever comes out in the fucture), then I have that dummy to add sound too. The Prototype of these passerger trains never had more then 4 engines (AAAA) so to stay "close" that would be all I would use anyway.

    The dummys in this case were about 33% of the price of the powered units...

    :tb-confused: :tb-confused: :tb-confused: :tb-confused:​
     
  20. EMD F7A

    EMD F7A TrainBoard Member

    1,250
    148
    26
    If, for whatever reason, oyu need a dumy loco- get an Atlas/Kato model, and strip the drivetrain and the top gear in the truck. Those trucks freeroll like nobodys business! (My Kato GP30's trucks roll off a flat table- they're that sensitive!)
     

Share This Page