Same here as well. There were broken detail parts at the bottom of the jewel case. These were under-body piping. Didn't even have a chance to break them myself. The plastic cradle to pull the loco out was a nice touch. Didn't have to pry the loco out of the foam with a finger nail. Just came straight out. These locos are surprisingly light compared to the Katos and Walthers that I have. Is this typical of FVMs? I wonder if this is the reason others have complained about pulling power and lack of traction (I'm thinking of our friend in the converted motor home). The ABA set that I got in Sept run nice and strong though. Overall, happy with the purchase despite the broken parts.
Ron, they did indeed come through the D/FW area quite frequently...I would guess at least a couple per week on average on the various BNSF trains, probably a even a few more. Now, go the Transcon and it's an entirely different story. Doubt you could go a day without seeing one. Regarding what years...well I'll state what I know based on what I've seen and read, which shouldn't be taken as gospel but should be a good place to start. They ran pretty steady from 1990 to 2008. Early they were premier intermodal power and then in the early/mid 2000's (say, 2003) began to migrate away from their intermodal roots to the point that by 2006 it was not very common to see them in intermodal service. From late 2008 to late 2011, many of the B's were taken out of service due primarily to the economy. They were supposedly being put back into service in late 2011 and there are reports of some in service. The M's stuck around, and from what I know all are currently in-service although that info may be a year or two old...haven't really looked since the FVM's were announced. I do know that at least a some of the M's are still in service. I model the North Texas to Panhandle area 1998-2003 and I currently have an ATSF GP60B. May eventually get an M but I have a limit on number of locos and I plan to run the B with my Atlas Dash 8 to get that "A-B warbonnet flavor" for now.
I dont own one...my observations are based on others reviews here on TB and other places online. As a 'runner' my concern is with all the small detail parts that seem to break or fall off if you just happen to look at them wrong :-( I...as well as many others...actually 'handle' (not manhandle) our trains. There will be times the thing will have to be taken off the layout and cleaned. This 'maintenance' may well include taking the locomotive apart to clean it. With it being so 'delicate' I fear broken and/or missing parts in no time. I know people have been screaming for years for all this fine detailing. For 'runners' it can be a nightmare ! I want one...really bad...just not sure I can pull the trigger. :-( I have already lost the front railing and snowplow on my ES44AC from 'working on it'. They just popped off and disappeared :-( Super Fine details are great...up to a point ! Perhaps its time the pendulum stops swinging in that direction. JMHO.
We saw the four pawed sets run around Barstow, down through Cajon Pass, Tehachapi, out to Needles, across the Arizona and New Mexico landscapes. There may have been more then one set but I wouldn't be able to confirm that. Old George, and his frustrations with those micro-mangled parts. I know of what you speak of and I sware my floor is alive and eats them parts up like it was a vacuum cleaner. Hummm? There was a time when we added those detail parts as opposed to breaking them off. The guys and gals got so paranoid and protective to the extreme where they wouldn't even open up to show their layouts to a trusted friend. Just something to think about.
Well, no confirmation of finding my missing parts and plenty of time to receive them by mail if they went out Tuesday. The store I bought them from is now out of stock. So I can find them other place for $5-$15 more, add $8 to return mine, another $8 to ship my new one you are talking $23 spent for nothing except to get a complete whole unit. May end up having to return the whole fricken thing. What 2-3 year wait to get this. VERY DISSAPPOINTING!!!
George, I only said that because I thought your ES44AC was a FVM model. You were having traction and pulling issues with it right? My observation of the GP60s were they were surprisingly light compared to other manufactures. So that might have explained the lack of pulling power. But if it wasn't an FVM then never mind.
We fixed the problem with George's locomotive. It was all in the decoder. I say we, because I worked with him to get it rolling.
It is a FVM Glennac. It still has its 'moments' that make me wanna pull what little hair I have left out. Thats another reason I'm leary about the GP60M :-S
I think you should back up that 'observation' with some measurements. While they are not heavy, I didn't notice them being 'surprisingly' light, especially considering they are a short length and come DCC ready. I would wager that FVM is using the same alloy or a very similar one as other manufacturers are nowadays, or at least the same as Atlas. Comparing to longer six axle Katos isn't fair, and neither is comparing to older locomotives that were either not DCC ready, or were made with now-banned lead alloys, or both. (And just to cover the bases, comparing to cab or cowl units is way unfair.) For what it's worth (which is admittedly not much), here are my measurements with my wife's extremely imprecise kitchen scale. Measurements are give or take a half ounce or so. hboy: Note these are all 4-axle locos (although the dash-8 is about as long as some older-prototype six axles). FVM GP60M and B ~2.6oz Atlas 8-40B ~3.2oz Atlas B23-7 ~3.0oz Atlas Classic GP35 DCC ready ~2.8oz LL/Walthers GP60 not DCC ready ~ 2.9oz Atlas Trainman GP15 ~ 2.8oz (all metal fuel tank) Atlas Classic GP35 not DCC ready 3.1 oz Atlas-Kato GP30 from early '90s: 3.5oz (not DCC ready) Kato GP50 from late '80s: 5.0oz (definitely a lead alloy frame) More accurate measurements are more than welcome, although this subject probably deserves its own thread. Finally, FWIW, my four FVM GP60s had no issue pulling a 10ft intermodal train up the 5% grade at the club.
Well Ben, bare in mind these are the first "modern" locos I've owned. I model transition-era diesel. So I'm accustomed to Kato Fs, GP38s, GP50s, Walthers C-Liners, and Kato's / Walthers / & Life-Like 3-axel offerings, which are, admittedly, paper weights (E3, E6, E8, PA/PBs Erie Builts, etc). So when your coming from that perspective, and not having anything "newer" than the 1960's running, these GP60's are feather lite, so to speak. I get what you're saying Ben and am not disparaging these models in the least. Despite their relative lightness, which I noticed the moment I pulled them from thier cradles, they are good solid pullers.
Glad to hear that they are decent pullers, I am still waiting a a B-unit for my ABBA. There are no grades on my clubs NTrak setup, but I am all about the long intermodals.....
Yup, that last sentence is absolutely true. But it's mainly because there's a lot less room for metal inside hood diesels, especially when you take some out to make room for a decoder. It's something us 'modern' guys have to struggle with. My Athearn F45s get a lot of run time because they are heavy pullers compared to all the hood diesels that they get consisted with. The Kato GP38 and GP50 are true outliers for 4 axles. Whatever alloy they used back then is simply twice as heavy as what is being used these days. Presumably it's lead, and that's why it's not seen anymore.
You know, even if you throw out the heavy outliers, you're still talking about anywhere from 7% to 18% lighter than anything previously. I'd call that surprising. Not meaning to pile on, but I did find your numbers interesting.
Here are recent Pictures of mine with all details on , trucks painted silver, fuel tanks relocated , fans dry brushed with silver, all lubed, motor tabs soldered to circuit board and horn openings painted black. I really like the look. I did confirm today one can NOT do a Kato motor swap though. Mike
I have a question for those of you who have both the GP60M's and the GP60B's AND have done some bit of tinkering, at least removing the shell and closely inspecting the mech. My question is: are the shells interchangeable? More specifically, could I put a GP60B shell on a GP60M mech? The only issue I can imagine with that is that the ditchlight setup might interfere. (assuming the GP60B doesn't have any ditchlight "guts". I haven't looked at mine yet...and I don't have an "M", btw) My goal is to have a single GP60M mech and interchange multiple GP60B and GP60M shells on that one mech.
You're right. :cute: I should say "I model mostly transition era...". And primarily streamlined diesel freight and passenger service. My GPs only consist of a single lashup of 2 GP38s and one GP50. The vast majority of my roundhouse, except for these new GP60s, are the 40s-50s streamline locos - about 60 total. Love the era.
Matt came through with the missing parts and now I am up and running and enjoying it. No harm no foul!! Now if I could get FVM to make some locos out of the 50's or 60's!!!
