First I apologize if this turns out to be a long diatribe and secondly go ahead and label me OCD (I won’t take offense), but when it comes to layout planning and construction I keep tabs of the costs and comparisons in a spreadsheet; even down to the last screw I use. Every now and then a thread surfaces here about various commercially available benchwork versus doing it yourself. I am not here to condemn these entrepreneurs or start a flame war because they do provide a valuable service to those who are “woodworking challenged”, don’t have the capabilities to construct benchwork themselves or have a project so large that they don’t have the time to do it themselves. But I think I have the skill sets and most of the tools to do a good job myself for my size project. This all started when I was comparing which dimensional lumber product I was going to use. I had always thought that buying longer lengths cut down on waste and costs. In addition, I was trying to compare costs of 6’ lengths vs. 8’ lengths and which was worth it in regards of transporting and carrying the pieces upstairs to my apartment. Now I had pretty much decided beforehand that I was going to use the best that I could buy from the big box store but I still wanted a comparison between the best and the next best. As it turns out the next best was about $10 more total for 8’ lengths vs. the 6’ lengths. On the other hand when it came to comparing the best (knot-free), it turns out that the 8’ lengths were a little over $3 less total vs. the 6’ lengths. Go figure! Now for convenience, the $3 dollars more I would have to pay for 6’ lengths didn’t really matter that much to me. Then the old brain cells really kicked in, what about ¾” birch (or red oak) plywood ripped into 3 ½” widths? When it comes to marketing commercial products made from cabinet-grade plywood, the main points are: plywood is much more dimensionally stable than regular lumber; the second ingredient is pocket-hole screws for assembly. Pocket-hole screws do two things, they make joints stronger by putting the screw thread into the side grain of the plywood instead of the end grain. This is sound marketing and I do agree with it; but on the other hand if you have the skill sets and tools, why can’t you do the same? Now I do have a power miter saw but not a table saw, so I asked the big box store how much they would charge me for ripping ¾” x 4’ x 8’ cabinet-grade birch (or red oak) plywood into 3 1/2 “ strips (same as 1x4 dimensional). With their cutter they can cut 3 ½” strips but the last 12” won’t fit into the cutter so that piece is not useable (well, not really I could use it on my top or for a shelf). So you are able to get about (10) 8’ strips out of a 4x8 sheet. This equates to about $4.50 per 3 ½” x 8’ piece. The final analysis for my project: (36” x 90” with a 12” x 72” staging addition) 1. #2 or better whitewood (some knots) - $60.48 + plywood top, screws etc: $45.75 for a total of $106.23 2. Select pine (no knots) - $143.01 + plywood top, screws etc: $45.75 for a total of $188.76 3. ¾” Birch (or red oak) plywood ripped to 1 x 4 dimensions - $72.00 + cut cost $4.00 + plywood top, screws etc: $45.75 for a total of $121.75. 4. Commercial package: $357.38 (does not include shipping which is approx. 15% of order) Since from the outset I had decided on the select pine, what do you think I’m leaning toward? Just some food for thought when it comes time in figuring your costs.
I completely agree with your analysis. I ended up going with dimensional lumber for the fact that I got knot free wood on sale at Menards for approximately 40% and they don't have a cutting service. It's very possible that next time I will go with the plywood instead. Plus it's not easy for me to get a sheet of plywood home. Now if you bought a straight edge for cutting wood you could have cut the strips your self with a circular saw and had the straight edge for the next module for your table!
I have a circular saw besides the miter saw and could do it myself but for $4.00 total cutting fees, let the big box boys do it.:teeth:
i do not have much faith in the accuracy of the cuts being made at the big box store,so i would recommend measuring every piece they cut for you as they cut it. i had a sheet of plywood cut down just to make it easier for me to handle by myself. there was not a piece with four square corners.
I built a module once with knot-free small dimensional wood of some nondescript variety. I picked it out carefully, and I checked to be sure the pieces I used were straight and true. I built the benchwork upside down on a large, flat table, to keep the top surface where the foam would go flat. I made my joints carefully and when I was done I had a nice, beautifully flat module. Within a year, a couple of the pieces in the middle warped, pushing up my foam and pretty much hosing over my track. It's just fortunate that I wasn't too terribly far along, so it's not like I lost scenery or ballast, but from then on I determined I would mill down my own plywood joists on my table-saw and just be done with it. I haven't looked back ever since.
Thanks for your comment. A similar situation has occurred in the past with me also and that is why I have been leaning more and more to plywood ripped to 1x4 size. Dimensional lumber is just that, lumber milled to a spec and then usually kiln dried to fall within that spec. I'm sure there is a tolerance within these specs because I have 6 pieces of 4' length sitting here in my room. Not any two are the same exact width and I have also noted that not every piece you see at the store is exactly 4', 6' long or whatever. My thought is simply it was the kiln drying process or the local humidity variances that can have a play in the scheme of things. That too is why I think it is wise to go with plywood for reasons stated earlier.
I think my problem was not the kiln drying but then the subsequent changes in humidity. If I had used this in construction, say a furring strips in a wall, it would have been nailed to stouter stuff and I don't think it would have had much of a chance to warp. It would have also had less of a humidity swing being in a wall. Put it in a module, and suddenly there are problems. I like using plywood joists because they are more stable, and I am glad my comment was helpful.
Charles, consider the following. Purchase the 4x8 sheet of plywood. Also purchase a very good 8' length of 1x4 to use as a rip guide for your circular saw. I assume you have two C-clamps with 2" or greater jaws. This allows you cut the plywood incrementaly to suit your application(s) as you progress. Further, it assures that you have an end-product that matches your needs exactly, not sorta close when cut at a box store. I have not addressed getting the plywood home, but driving slowly with a foam pad on the car roof and heavy twine, you should make it OK with only few irrated folks behind you. -o)
Hank, the big box store is less than a mile from the apartment so wouldn't be too many irate drivers. My big problem is I would have to cut it outside and there is no outlet for me to hook up at the apartment. I can get it transported in my step-daughter's truck and do it at their place but then I would have to depend on her and sometimes that is a little difficult. She doesn't have the best track record in that regard but that is probably the route I will go.
I like working with wood and I have several tools that make it easy to get my lumber to the size I need. A radial arm saw for cross cuts, a table saw for ripping, a thickness planner for milling thinner lumber and a jointer for truing the edges. I have also been lucky in finding most of the lumber I use for free. When I am driving around in my pickup I look for places where renovations are being done to homes or businesses. I ask the workers or homeowner if I can have the scraps. Two years ago a homeowner was doing a renovation on his home and was throwing out about 200 board feet of 1" X 6" and 1" X 8" T&G pine lumber which was in his home for over thirty years. Nice and dry and stable. After ripping off the tongues and grooves and truing the edges I had some beautiful boards. I have been able to make dozens of HO, N-Trak and T-Trak modules, benchwork for my home layout and many other non-modeling projects with my finds over the years and still have some left.
Charles, a 100' 16 AWG extension cord will carry the short-term loads of a 7-1/2" circular saw. They're not expensive, ~$17 @ Home Depot or Lowe's, and you have them forever.
The supplier of pre-cut and drilled parts that I have checked on will not ship any thing over 48" as well. So I would need two 4'x4' modules for a 4'x8' module. Then I would need two more legs. The size you want would be over $600. :startled:
Thanks Hank, I have such a beast but the real problem is where I'm located on the second floor. I would have to set up behind the building but the obstacle there is it is uneven ground and a holding pond located there. Makes for an unstable environment to work on. You're doing your best to help. I need to move back to Ocean Springs and the house we rented there.
Hank, I just have to convince the missus. She would do it in a heartbeat if it wasn't for the grandkids. BTW, my problem has been solved. This morning after Mass I talked to one of our parishioners who is a new home builder and remodeling contractor. He is going to rip the plywood for me after Christmas is over. The rest I can handle in the apartment.
I actually just posted about this not long ago. Here is my experience with a few pics. http://nscaleaddiction.blogspot.com/2012/11/n-scale-model-railroad-best-practices.html HuskerN
