Not to belabor the point, but those are some pretty sensational rock formations showing the skilled use of foam....not to mentions the foam's flexibility. I'm modeling SW Washington logging. The area has a dearth of rock formations below 4-5000 feet......except for river valleys, where the over burden from glacier deposits have been scoured out, and a few volcanic Basalt upthrusts. Basically, the area is left with hills covered with "glacial till"......orange dirt infested with rocks (up to the size of small houses). Close to the Columbia river, all this was re-arranged by the catastrophic floods from the last ice age....Lake Missoula's multiple trips to the Pacific ocean. Back eddy deposits left some nice farm land that used to be in Eastern Washington......500 *cubic miles* of water will do stuff like that. The area's land above 400ish feet is good for growing trees and not much else. Consequently, I had to invent some rock formations if I wanted any. Them old loggers would go to great lengths to avoid any rock cutting...or even dirt cuts...too expensive for temporary RRs, but it it makes it tough for modelers who seem to like spectacular rock cuttting. I'm left with upthrusts which are prototypical but semi rare.
OK, if you're going to harangue people over what's logical or illogical, let's look at what you've said. Comparing Styrofoam fumes to .45 bullets makes even less sense than anything I've said. Unless you concentrate the fumes in a bag and inhale them (as some idiots might be tempted to do), they're not about to kill you. At worst, they will be an irritant, or give you a headache. For some of us, they're not an issue at all. So to say that "All you need is fresh air to get rid of the fumes" is applicable for those that are bothered by them, and "[they] aren't bad anyway" is to say they aren't deadly, and applies to those that aren't bothered by them. Could I have phrased it better? Absolutely. No argument. But I would not call the "logic police" over it--I don't suppose you've ever said or written something that didn't come out quite right. Getting back on topic... as for cost: look for a commercial construction site in your area. Extruded Styrofoam sheets can often be had for free if you do a little dumpster diving. It's amazing what gets thrown out.
I did not compare .45 bullets to styrofoam fumes. I used an analogy to demonstrate the fallacy of saying it is necessary to protect yourself from something and in the same sentence saying that the thing you are protecting yourself from is harmless. I apologize for having confused you with a simple literary tool to make a rational point.
OK, the stuff can stink when you cut it with hot wire......high temp. more so than low temp......& prolly ain't good for you. Stick to cardboard & sissors. Do you have anything else to add to the conversation, Mr. Stoker?
I never said anybody should not use styrofoam because of the health issues. I simply pointed out that stating you should protect yourself from the fumes of cutting foam and then in the same sentence stating that the fumes were harmless was a logical fallacy. That is all, nothing more. I don't put words in your mouth, and I would appreciate being extended this same courtesy.
Folks, this is a hobby and a friendly website for sharing ideas. Too often we have people saying things, and taking comments, in personal ways and going off the tracks in response. We as a community don't need this, it does nothing to further any of the discussions or to help others, and it has caused potentially great discussions to be locked. In short, knock the nonsense off.
Yeah, no need to bicker...After all the positives about foam, maybe I'm in MRRing denial.. Maybe it is time to accept the new way and learn to use foam...It is attractive as having the ability to pile on as much altitude as we like and be able to slice it back down if we're changing the scene..I was looking at a yellowish (or was it blue ?), about 2" thick 4x8 foam which has that silver coating for about $15.00 at Home Depot ..I believe we can use this and peel off the silver coat first, no ? Then we cut it, yellow-glue it to layout bench and glue more layers if necessary, saw it, shape it, coat it (plaster and/or beige paint it)..scenic it, yes ? Thanks for all the great responses, Mark
I've experimented a bit with finding the glue I like to glue foam layers together. At first, I used hot glue (low temp) which works pretty good until you have a big piece (the glue cools before I can get the piece down) or until you have intricate carving to do...hot glue just doesn't carve too well. Then, I thought Liquid Nails would be the cat's meow, and it works great for sticking pieces together, but it REALLY doesn't carve well. My last attempt was using Aileen's Tacky Glue, which works well if used like contact cement...putting a layer on both pieces and letting it almost dry (ALMOST) before stacking. Additionally, it just doesn't interfere with carving, which for my applications is important. I know people use several different water-based glues and swear by them, but I've also heard stories of a stink arising after a few months after gluing foam layers together using Elmer's or Yellow Carpenter's Glue because all of the glue didn't dry (foam is not absorbent) and stuff started growing in the wet glue after a few months... Just sayin'... I agree with David (DKS) that you can find different thicknesses of extruded polystyrene foam at construction sites if you look and most of the time, it's free, but be sure to ask. Although I buy most of mine (Dow Styrofoam) in 2" X 4' X 8' sheets, I picked up some 3" stuff that was had been used as a concrete form at a municipal construction site. Some of it is ultra dense, and I'm gonna use it for my twin curved tunnel liners on my Taggart's LDE, cutting the tunnel bores with my home-made hot-wire tool with a special NiChrome wire formed to the correct high-pressure tunnel liner profile. I'm not sure if it'll work, but I'm gonna give it a try. As for extruded polystyrene foam smoke's harmfulness. I did some research on it a few years ago since I was breathing a lot of it, and the general finding is that it's the same as breathing wood smoke. I suppose if you breathed it day in and day out, it might harm you, but the amounts you'll inhale in the course of building your layout are not harmful. In today's litigious society, if it was harmful, there would probably be a warning on it somewhere. The only caveat is that if you're allergic to wood smoke, or have emphysema or asthma, you should probably wear a mask. Cheerio! Bob Gilmore
Thanks, it came out as well as I could have expected for a wild ***** idea. hboy: It was a PITA however. I used a bent to shape (octagonal) cutter then belt sanded the sides flat......the sanding dust was some nasty stuff....PPE is a must and the shape uniformity sucked.....this goes into the "gawd awful mess" section of the ledger. I would NOT recommend this to anyone but a masochist with a lot of time on his hands. The pic shows about 10% of the columns I made.
Yes, that is the way I have seen it done. Do peel off the clear, thin sheet. I can't think of any reason to retain it for our purposes and it does degrade the gluing. I use full strength white glue but the yellow may be better; never tried it. Seems like I recall the glue being slow to dry if it doesn't get any air like between the layers in the center of the landform. On my club we only use plaster. We have been through 1700 pounds of molding plaster so far. I can tell you it is a mess. I have never seen so much dust and debris settle down on the finished parts of the layout. I presume it is the nature of plaster. Thing is, we have some beautiful rocks. I think we should have stuck to the plaster for the rocks and construction foam for the landforms. This has been a very good thread, so far, IMHO.
The silver coat is foil. Cutting this style foam board seems to me a bit messier than the blue or pink, but otherwise just use an adhesive that won't attack the foam. Get busy, and be sure to post up some progress photos!
Amen to that. I got a lot of styrofoam that way (dumpster diving) in our community. Contractors are using more styrofoam to comply with EPA standards for energy efficiency. Usually they will order by the pallet load and usually that means they get more sheets than are needed. I have obtained a lot of full sheets as well as smaller sizes out of dumpsters. I even made a tool to snag the pieces so I did not have to enter the dumpster. Just a mop or broom handle with a nail driven through it. Simple but effective. Let's face it, when they pick up that dumpster it is just going to a landfill. I am just recycling building materials.
Hmmm.....broom handle with nail..You might check out if the city parks commission needs a leaf picker-upper, seeing as how you now own the proper tool !!
