Why do they put that slippery black 'stuff' on the tread of locomotive wheels ? I can understand blackening on the inside and outside surfaces for aesthetic reasons. But why on the tread ? !!! The stuff is slicker then goose snot and does absolutely nothing for traction or electrical pick up. In fact...the affect is the opposite. The locomotives are lucky to be able to pull themselves down the track...let alone cars ! I have read of all kinds of methods for removing it off the tread...from using sanding sticks to some pretty caustic liquids ! Manufacturers never tell you when you buy that new locomotive that the first thing ya need to do is get that blackened crap off the tread to get your locomotive to pull like it should !! Its like a dealer selling you a new car with slicks for tires and you expecting it to run great in snow or rain...or they figure its a no brainer that you will drive off the lot and to the nearest tire place to put good tires on it !! Is it really that hard to NOT put the blackening on the tread at the manufacturing level ? Whats the object of doing so ? Is it a simple thing like its easier to dip the whole wheel in the blackening and let the modeler figure out that they need to...and how to...get rid of it off the tread ? Do manufactures really believe it helps with traction and elctrical conductivity ? Is it part of breaking-in of the locomotive ? We run new locomotives by themselves for hours in each direction to 'seat' everything AND hopefully remove the blackening off the tread ? Is it supposed to be some common knowledge thing ? "Hey dummy...ya gotta get the black stuff off the tread first before ya try to pull cars...everyone nows that!" Enquiring minds want to know...TIA. :question:
They are patiently waiting, watching the websites for a good laugh. The minute you started to complain they started to laugh. Hawhawhawheeheehee we got old George....AGAIN :teeth:....hawhawhawheeheehee. That's why! Sorry, George but the world is just plain cruel and idiots who want to antagonize our personalities types are born every second of the day. Same thing on my computer, my internet provider has a guy sitting on a pole with the wire to my phone line in his hand, plugging it in then unplugging it... having the most uproarious belly laughs. Got him heeheehee, got him again, hawhawhaw and again and it goes on all day long. At the end of the day, someone's belly has to be hurting and I would sware they are doing this in shifts. So much fun! I'm sorry we need to recover the web page. Hawhawhaw LOL while I'm spitting nails, having cows (a real herd but not in N scale) cussing, swearing, some more cussing, some more swearing and so goes the day. Darn boys and girls at the big V. With notices in the mail suggesting I switch over to wireless and pay $150.00 dollars a month. Who said that would be any different. Same guy, same pole only he pulls the plug somewhere to the lines feeding the tower. I can see him thinking, time to get old Rick again. Heeheehee hawhawhaw. Got him and most likely they have a way to hear me cussing and swearing. I must be putting on a real show for them. :sweat:Hurrumph! As I edit this and add the smiley or not so smiley faces he's doing it again. Darn blasted, skunk gizzard, idiotic bozo's. edit: Now it's telling me my message is to short. @#*()
I've not noticed this as a problem area either. But I do tend to run shorter trains (10-20 cars) on a flat as a board small modular layout. That blacking does seem to wear off rather quickly so when I do take locomotives to a show or the club layout, they seem to perform about the same as other members same model and mfg loco. The only difference being the consists and wheel sets being used on freight cars.
Maybe the reason that they apply it is because modelers don't want wheels that are completely shiny; they want wheels that look at least somewhat more prototypical. And, maybe they don't just apply it on the front and back sides because the ENTIRE wheel is either dipped or chemically treated (you know, for the blackening effect). Or, maybe they just do it to see if someone will post on a bulletin board about it. We may never know.
Big basket of wheels dropped in bigger tub of chemicals, then a rinse or neutralizer, dumped out to dry then to truck assembly line. Cheap one person, semi automated if not completely automated.
I suppose this all goes back to my FVM ES44AC (remember that thread?)...and a few other recent threads on pulling problems. After buying a good quality wire wheel for my dremel and using low speed...with the loco upside down in a cradle...with power applied..and the wheels spinning in the opposite direction as the wire wheel. I was able to somewhat quicky dispatch that black on the treads of all the wheels. Now she runs just fine...even pulling 20+ cars...where before it struggled to pull 10 ! I do have 2% grades. No great conspiracy theory...I just feel its somehow all connected...thnxs. hboy:
Uhh...errr....guys and gals. Denial can be a wonderful thing. A great place to hide until we are able to deal with the realities around us. BUT! This isn't the first time this has been discussted (spelling intended). I was discussing a problem I had with a Badman 4-8-4 with the black on the tread on the tires and it was slipping all over the place. Once the black was worn off I ended up pulling ten cars up my 2% grade. I was so advised to be patient with it by one our own...prestigious...first class...model railroaders. Ok, so I forgot who. but thinking it was either Bob, Russell or Kenneth. Does that help? edit: Ok maybe it wasn't Russell, he doesn't have any grades...col.
George, do you think (by any chance) that this may be why my Kato NW2 doesn't pull as many cars as my other locos? - Please refer to separate thread. I've just tried your method with my wheel cleaning brush: it does make a difference but I agree with you that we shouldn't have to clean the wheels before we set them on the track. Regards, Pete Davies
The blackening is done on the entire wheel, not just the face and flanges. The blackening wears off the treads, so if you do proper break in of locos, the blackening will wear off before you use the loco to pull any loads.
But Ike... What is considered a 'proper break in' to get that blackening off ? One hour ? 2 hours? 12 hours? 48 hours? etc...etc.. Or is it a guessing game depending on locomotive manufactuer ? Myself...I believe I will use the Dremel wire brush on any future new loco wheels to get the black off FIRST...then put it on the track and run it a round a bit...to 'seat' everything inside. I just dont believe running a loco around a layout until the blackening wears off the tread face...no matter how long that takes...should be part of the 'break in period'. JMO of course....thnxs. Just maybe cleaning the wheel treads first will save more then frustration of a poor operating NEW locomotive for other modelers...who knows ;-)
i do sand the wheels of all my locos. remove the shell, add two wires, run the loco upside down and use the smoothest sandpaper. a polishing disk of a dremel works as well. just press it slightly onto the wheels. there are some members that never expected traction issues. well, then you're not running your equipment hard enough. i do run 75-80 car coal trains on my layout. each car weighted at 43-44gramms. it would need 3-4 brand new kato es44ac to move the train. with sanded wheels i need an es44ac in front and a second one cut in after 40 cars. yes, i run 75-80 coal cars with only two engines ! (or 80 atlas 23500gal tank cars with only two engines). layout is flat but lots of curves. especially a 200 degree curve with 19" radius.
Pete...every little bit helps. ;-) I just wanted to get from 10 cars and a slipping locomotive up to 12 cars and no slipping with my one ES44AC...as that is the length of the shortest track in Lucky Penny Yard. I can now get 12 cars easy with that one locomotive...so I am happy once again
PCM/BLI was one the worst offenders as far as excessive wheel blackening goes. It used to be that out of the box a lot of their locos barely ran. I'm guessing this must've resulted in scads of returns because starting with their PA/PB release they've stopped using the wheel blackening stuff entirely. Cheers, -Mark
Not running them hard enough? I doubt I could get 75 coal hoppers on my layout, unless I put some in the sidings, small run around track, city streets, etc. I guess I could flop the motor in a unit or 2 and have locomotive tug of wars. Might be interesting to see how that would work out.....
I'd say atleast an hour in each direction, for nothing other to get the motor and gears broken in. But with the wire brush, if you do it too long, you could cause scratches in the wheels causing a place to dirt and crud to accumulate. A good wheel cleaning should work.
