BNSF derailment

BoxcabE50 May 6, 2015

  1. BoxcabE50

    BoxcabE50 HOn30 & N Scales Staff Member TrainBoard Supporter

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    Just on morning radio news. Heard a report of an oil train derailment and fire. Not sure I caught the alleged location, but believe they said Heimdal, North Dakota.
     
  2. BoxcabE50

    BoxcabE50 HOn30 & N Scales Staff Member TrainBoard Supporter

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    It is Heimdal. Had a picture forwarded, but as I don't know the source, cannot post it. Big fire.
     
  3. Eagle2

    Eagle2 Staff Member TrainBoard Supporter

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  4. BoxcabE50

    BoxcabE50 HOn30 & N Scales Staff Member TrainBoard Supporter

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    Notice how they so cleverly introduced reference to the Canadian tragedy. An incident which is not at all the same in circumstance or outcome.
     
  5. Randy Stahl

    Randy Stahl TrainBoard Supporter

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    The Megantic wreck was the WORST case scenario in every way, all others will forever be compared with it.
     
  6. BoxcabE50

    BoxcabE50 HOn30 & N Scales Staff Member TrainBoard Supporter

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    Unfortunately.

    I am just looking at this from the viewpoint of how media goes about constantly, deliberately stirring public emotions and unrest.
     
  7. hoyden

    hoyden TrainBoard Supporter

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    In MN there's a big push to spend more on railroad crossing safety, and absolutely no mention of building a certain pipeline.
     
  8. BoxcabE50

    BoxcabE50 HOn30 & N Scales Staff Member TrainBoard Supporter

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    Any updates on controlling the fire? I wonder if they'll be able to quickly determine cause. It will be a melted mess.

    Interesting how they reference it as a town. There are maybe two to three dozen people. I don't know if they even have a business there, but just some houses.
     
  9. HemiAdda2d

    HemiAdda2d Staff Member TrainBoard Supporter

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    All the more reason the FRA wants tougher tank cars. The problem is tank car manufacturers don't have the throughput to retrofit or reconstruct the current crude oil fleet in under 3-5 years. Even then, FRA-commissioned studies show the robustness of pressurized (double walled) tank cars is insufficient even at 18 MPH. The amount of metal required to enable lading containment/crashworthiness in a head collision at 30 MPH is more than 6 inches of steel; at 25 MPH, a shell impact (side) would require at least 3". Making a car crash-resistant to retain lading at track speeds will make the cars prohibitively heavy, reducing payload. Slowing trains down threatens bottlenecks in the supply chain, not to mention infuriating the industry.
    The FRA recently enacted speed restrictions when transiting population centers, but what about small towns like Heimdal?

    I wonder what the NTSB will find is the root cause? Wheel defects? Track failure?

    Reference: Applied Research Associates, Inc.
    Detailed Puncture Analyses of Various Tank Car Designs. Steven
    Kirkpatrick, no report number (Mountain View: Applied Research Associates, Inc, 2010), 261-262
     
  10. BoxcabE50

    BoxcabE50 HOn30 & N Scales Staff Member TrainBoard Supporter

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    They can build new cars which will reduce chance of rupture, but as far as eliminating that possibility, no. Also, at the end, everyone will pay more at the pump, etc.

    Just for fun, take a look at an aerial photo of Heimdal. It is a tiny settlement. I'd bet almost nobody in the USA even knew it existed, until yesterday.
     
  11. Charlie

    Charlie TrainBoard Member

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    probably all of the above but the carriers AND car owners must assume culpability as well. As a retired railroader I can attest to how much rolling junk is out there. Find a railroad that operates a good deal of manifest freight trains,position yourself where you are not on the property or violating any other rules and watch and listen as the manifest train goes by. I bet you it will sound like a marching band practicing what with all the flat spots on the wheels banging and the running gear rattling. That is negligence, plain and simple! Carelessness in switching operations by dragging cuts of cars with handbrakes applied, coupling cars at too high rate of speed, splitting switches etc. Years ago carriers like the Pennsy would have car inspectors in pits underneath the "hump". These pits were equipped with bright lights to illuminate the undersides of cars. An actual human would inspect each car as it passed over and if a defect was spotted, the inspector would activate a device that would spray light colored paint on a truck of the damaged car. Carriers need to have better inspections of their rolling stock other than dragging equipment detectors. A comprehensive program of inspection,car handling and train handling will have to be implemented and/or existing rules and special instructions for hazmat trains be more closely monitored and enforced. Car owners will have to do the same and the courts will have to impose severe fines and punishment for violators. Nothing gets a railroad's attention more than having to spend or lose money. Yes, standards for tank and hazmat cars needs to be re-examined and PLAUSIBLE(my emphasis) solutions found and applied to hazmat cars. Also,(and this is my personal rant) ONE MAN train operations are NOT the answer to any train operation, hazmat or otherwise. Lac Megantic might not have happened or not been as severe had there been a two man crew and all safety rules observed AND a union crew vs. a "scab" crew operating the train. Folks....it's the time-worn caveat..."You get what you pay for" . Lac Megantic is your example of doing things on the "cheap" .
     
  12. BoxcabE50

    BoxcabE50 HOn30 & N Scales Staff Member TrainBoard Supporter

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    Another cause of flat spots is every time some dumbbell, in vehicle or afoot, crosses in front of a train and the engineer must made a hard brake application. Guess what slides.....

    About seven or eight years ago, I was riding Amtrak #7. Sixteen hours sitting atop a flat spotted wheel, which was like riding on a machine gun. It was very unpleasant.
     
  13. HemiAdda2d

    HemiAdda2d Staff Member TrainBoard Supporter

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    Charlie, i respect your comments a lot. I really don't know much about the 1 man operation you speak of. Is it the PTC program?
     
  14. BoxcabE50

    BoxcabE50 HOn30 & N Scales Staff Member TrainBoard Supporter

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    If I had my way, I would lean on the appropriate Federal authority. To do what? To mandate the use of cabooses on any train handling hazmat. Two people aboard the caboose, to watch both sides of the train. Would this eliminate all problems? No. But it would surely help reduce problems. Costs? Balanced against cleanups and litigation, well... Two sets of eyes up front, and two in back cannot be a negative where safety is concerned.
     
  15. Hytec

    Hytec TrainBoard Member

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    Ken, if nothing more, it might provide evidence of management concern for hazmat trains, which might reduce some of the media and public ignorant misinformation.
     
  16. Charlie

    Charlie TrainBoard Member

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    No, Hemi, PTC is an entirely different thing. The one man crew I'm referring to is either radio controlled operation or engineer only in the cab. The Lac Megantic thing was an engineer only crew. He left the train improperly secured when the crew van came to pick him up. IIRC criminal proceeding are or have taken place regarding that crewman.
     
  17. Charlie

    Charlie TrainBoard Member

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    I'll tell you what is another "fun" ride; ride in a passenger coach with a truck that has major "truck hunting". That happens pretty much in commuter train operation with their stop-go,changing speed, irregular braking operations etc. I've reported it several times myself when I yarded a train at the Zephyr Pit for servicing. One time we evacuated a coach and closed it down since the truck hunting was so bad.

    Charlie
     
  18. logandsawman

    logandsawman TrainBoard Member

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    Most of the oil train accidents seem to be cars coming off the track..do they tell us if that is because the track is bad or what specific details lead up to the derailment?

    I am curious about that. Does one car come off and take others with it, and what stops the chain reaction?

    Is the final report public, and where can it be found?
     
  19. BoxcabE50

    BoxcabE50 HOn30 & N Scales Staff Member TrainBoard Supporter

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    That same train I mentioned above, when it got out to Puget Sound, was really late. I forget how many hours, somewhere between four and six, perhaps more. Anyhow, they were 'pushing' it a bit here and there, to make up time and dodge the BNSF. That line between Everett and Seattle is very winding in places. Back and forth, back and forth. Our car was hunting on some of those curves. I knew what it was, but a few of the others around me did not. There were some huge BANGS when it did this, with quite a stiff jolt each time to us. Folks were looking around at each other. The tide was in, and swimming would have been necessary....
     
  20. Randy Stahl

    Randy Stahl TrainBoard Supporter

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    The Canadian and American crews on the MMA were very much union members.
     

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