DCC Wiring for Peco Electrofrog Xing

Backshop Jul 24, 2014

  1. Backshop

    Backshop TrainBoard Member

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    This is the first time I've included a live frog crossing in my track plans, and also my first DCC layout. The Peco EF crossings come with four wires attached to the frogs... how do I wire these in on a DCC circuit? The instructions only show a DC set-up.
    I'm also assuming the Atlas crossings have the same live frog wire attachments? As I plan on using an Atlas Xing too.
     
  2. retsignalmtr

    retsignalmtr TrainBoard Member

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    Are you referring to a switch or a crossing track. They are different. Pecos live frog switches have jumpers soldered in under the frog. You do not have to do anything with them. They are there to provide electrical continuity. You do have to use insulated joiners on the ends of the frog rails before putting down the next pieces of track. The frog is powered when the points are in contact with either stock rail. If you are using a switch machine with auxiliary contacts you can use them to power the frog instead of depending on point contact.
     
  3. Suzie

    Suzie TrainBoard Member

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    It depends to some extent what your track plan is as to how it is easiest to wire it. Can you upload the track plan showing the crossing?
     
  4. DougSluder

    DougSluder TrainBoard Member

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    Peco refers to there switches as turnouts, so if you are talking about a SL-E393F or a SL-E394F here is a image showing what the wires feed :
    The long and short crossing in code 80 are all insulfrog so I think you are talking about code 55.

    Doug
     

    Attached Files:

  5. Inkaneer

    Inkaneer TrainBoard Member

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    Guys, I don't think he is referring to a switch or a turnout (whatever you wish to call it). Rather I think he is speaking of a crossing also called a diamond in some areas. I went with the C55 Insulfrog long crossings for my layout. Haven't instaled them yet due to shortage of track.
     
  6. retsignalmtr

    retsignalmtr TrainBoard Member

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    I have had people at shows ask what type of crossings (switches) we were using on the clubs layout so you never know for sure without asking for more info.
     
  7. Backshop

    Backshop TrainBoard Member

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    This is a SL-E393F Short Crossing (PECO also calls them Diamond Crossings). Not a switch, it's a piece where 2 separate routes cross only. The insert doesn't have any info on DCC wiring, they say to write them direct about any questions. Don't know why they don't have DCC instructions on their part insert.
    The crossing is in the middle of where a double-track main splits into 2 separate double-track mains (the routes do not rejoin again). The mains will be usually be one-way in each direction (RH running on double track) but sometimes a train will be routed "wrong way" over the junction.
     
  8. DougSluder

    DougSluder TrainBoard Member

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    Attached Files:

  9. PaulBeinert

    PaulBeinert TrainBoard Supporter

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    Backshop,
    Is this going to be part of a reversing loop?
    A track diagram would probably help us give the correct answer.
     
  10. Backshop

    Backshop TrainBoard Member

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    I'd love to give a diagram if I knew how to post an Anyrail file to this forum. However the previous link gives me my answer: auto reversing module. The trackwork is just a line branching off the main to go to a staging yard. In this case it's a double-track main branching into a double track diverging route so two of the tracks have to cross each other. The "double track" main is actually a single track that loops around at both ends with the two mains put close together. So each track has the reverse polarity of the other. It would seem an autoreversing circuit is the way to go for DCC.
    But this is making me re-think using Electrofrog diamonds for my other 3 active crossings -- that's a lot of reversing circuits.
    BTW I do have a thread about my "New Haven-ish" layout in the layout building forum, with a track plan.
     
  11. PaulBeinert

    PaulBeinert TrainBoard Supporter

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    Backshop,
    You can post .any files just like any other file. You also have the option in AnyRail to export the layout to a JPG that you can post.
     
  12. Backshop

    Backshop TrainBoard Member

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    this is the anyrail plot of the junction providence.jpg

    Four station tracks (2 per main) join into two lines at the left end, then each line splits into two different routes by going through the diamond. The tracks going upward head into a dead-end staging area; the two tracks going down are part of the continuous circuit loop of the layout.
    With DCC there are no positive/negative rails, both rails carry the same A/C charge?
     

    Attached Files:

  13. PaulBeinert

    PaulBeinert TrainBoard Supporter

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    Backshop,
    The diamond crossing needs to be wired as if it was a reversing loop using the information in post #8.

    When wiring for DCC, you need to follow the same basic rules as DC. While it might not be pos n neg but you need to trat it that way.
     
  14. Backshop

    Backshop TrainBoard Member

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    OK, I understand the frogs should be on a reverse loop -- what about the outside rails? They connect or are continuous between the LH rails of one route and the RH rails of another route. There are 4 leads on the Peco crossing. Does this mean I have to completely insulate the crossing's rails at all ends and wire up another reversing circuit to the outer rails?
     
  15. DougSluder

    DougSluder TrainBoard Member

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    Backshop, go back a look at post 4 that shows where the four leads go. The yellow wire feed one frog, red the other frog, blue one rail and green the other rail. OK now look at post 8, the buss wires (booster) connect to the rails on crossing, red and blue (post 8) the frogs are connecter to output of your auto-reverser. The input of the AR is connected to buss wires. Note that there is a insulated joiner on all four frog rails. Looking at your drawing all the track leaving the crossing are wired normally. You would only need another AR if you have a reversing loop. Hope this helps.

    Doug
     
  16. USAF_Andrew

    USAF_Andrew TrainBoard Member

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    Please forgive me if this has been addressed, as I am about to go to bed, but using the crude drawing below. Would the diamond located on the left hand side of the sketch still be wired up the same as shown in the wiringfordcc.com image? Something inside my head is saying it would need more feeders and insulated joiners. The sketch just happens to be a rough idea of some layout planning that I am doing, so please forgive the crudeness of it. Thanks.
    Andrew
    [​IMG]
     
  17. DougSluder

    DougSluder TrainBoard Member

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    Andrew,
    I think that Atlas crossings have insulated frogs at least my crossing in code 80 does, don't know about code 55. Peco in code 80 also have insulated frogs only Peco code 55 can have electro frogs. If you have plastic on the diamond then it is insulated and will not require more insulated joiners. As requiring more feeders only if you have a problem with a loco stalling on the crossing. I don't have any problems with my crossings. If you have a Peco electro frog then it will require a AR and insulated joiners.
    Doug
     
  18. USAF_Andrew

    USAF_Andrew TrainBoard Member

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    The layout will be Peco 55. I was wanting to use it for the crossing, but there is more variety of angle with the Atlas code 80. I am pretty sure the majority of my equipment should be ok when it comes to stalling. Weathered and ballasted, you wouldn't hardly be able to tell. Your profile says you are in Chester, is that still the case? I am in Sumter.
     
  19. Suzie

    Suzie TrainBoard Member

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    Backshop

    Here is the simple way to wire the diamond for your junction. It simply requires a double pole switch that operates in conjunction with turnout A which is used to control the route through the diamond. As long as you do not set two conflicting routes through the diamond the switching will be correct.

    providence.jpg

    If you are using Peco solenoid motors the Peco PL15 switch will do the job, if you are using servos the Signalist SC2 servo decoder has the frog switching built in, and most slow motion motors will have suitable contacts that can be wired up appropriately.

    If it makes life easier the switch can be on turnout B instead, it all depends on which turnout is the key one for route setting.
     

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