NYC Hoop Up at Gridley

rhensley_anderson Apr 7, 2011

  1. rhensley_anderson

    rhensley_anderson TrainBoard Supporter

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    Looking east from Gridley Tower at the South Anderson Cut Off, track Orders were given. Manual Hoop Up ended about 1949-50.
    George Witt Photo (deceased) - Ron Stuckey Collection

    [​IMG]
     
  2. Hytec

    Hytec TrainBoard Member

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    Great photo. I remember seeing this often on the B&M, along with the semaphore controlled by the station agent. Although I don't remember ever seeing a hooping platform. Orders were hooped up from the ground using two different hoops, a very long one for the cab and a short one for the caboose. Also, if the empty hoops were not tossed back onto the ground within a short distance, the station agent would be quite vocal with his displeasure at having to walk the extra distance....:tb-mad:
     
  3. BoxcabE50

    BoxcabE50 HOn30 & N Scales Staff Member TrainBoard Supporter

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    Sometimes the regular train crew would have a spare set of hoops. They would toss down that one, and simply replace it with the one just received. So an operator would not need to go chopping in the brambles to get his hoops back.

    Just checked my list and it shows that I do have an NYCRR train order copied at "Gridley."

    Boxcab E50
     
  4. Hytec

    Hytec TrainBoard Member

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    Neat...can you tell if it is the one being hooped up? :tb-wink:
    Was there any difference between cab and caboose orders, or were they carbon copies?
     
  5. BoxcabE50

    BoxcabE50 HOn30 & N Scales Staff Member TrainBoard Supporter

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    There is no difference in what was hooped up. It had to be all identical or someone was in BIG trouble. If you've ever seen the engineer and conductor compare time and read orders at their originating station, or pictures thereof, that is one part of the safety ritual.

    There was the operator file copy, and all others were matched to it. (This true for any and all other orders, clearances and any messages.) There was one original and the rest were carbons. You can find a single copy, which was an order addressed strictly to the operator and would be filed. This could be an annulment or informational. The next number was three: operator, engineer and conductor. And from there it went up as needed for additional concerned parties.....

    My Gridley order is dated August 15, 1943.

    Boxcab E50
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Apr 7, 2011
  6. fitz

    fitz TrainBoard Member

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    Those were the days. Thanks, Roger for posting another great photo, and thanks for the explanation, Ken. Do you have a link for the NYCS train order in your collection?
    :tb-biggrin:
     
  7. BoxcabE50

    BoxcabE50 HOn30 & N Scales Staff Member TrainBoard Supporter

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    Jim-

    I do not have my NYC stuff on line as yet. Am busily finishing my B&M right now, which may be up by this evening.

    I would be willing to put up an abbreviated NYC page with a few requests. :D Doing an NYC page will be a fair project as I have over 300 locations NYCRR. Add to that predecessors such as NYC&HR, and then subsidiaries using NYCS forms such as the P&E.... It takes a while to scan, re-size and so on. Some day....

    Boxcab E50
     
  8. Hytec

    Hytec TrainBoard Member

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    It would be neat if you have an order from the New York & Harlem RR, the forerunner of the NYC Harlem Division, or from the Harlem after being absorbed into the newly formed New York Central in April, 1873.

    I believe the Harlem was the first of all NYC forerunners and divisions, being formed on April 25, 1831, with construction starting in March (or May), 1832. The first revenue trips were by Horsecar in November, 1832 from near the tip of lower Manhattan up to where GCT is today. Though I doubt if you would have an order from the 1830s....:tb-tongue:
    Information source from "The Coming Of The New York And Harlem Railroad", Louis Grogan, 1989.
     
  9. BoxcabE50

    BoxcabE50 HOn30 & N Scales Staff Member TrainBoard Supporter

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    Hank-

    Sent you a PM.

    Train orders were not used until the first one during 1851.

    If you guys (Roger, Hank, Jim, LEW, anyone), each want to try naming a few NYCS family stations, I'll see if or what I have and put up a page!

    Boxcab E50


     
  10. Hytec

    Hytec TrainBoard Member

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    Seeing that you have some Boston & Albany orders, you may have some that involve Chatham, NY. Chatham was the northern terminal of the Harlem where it interchanged not only with the B&A, but also with the Rutland Corkscrew Division from North Bennington, VT. I assume any Rutland order would have originated from North Bennington, being the division point for three lines, one north to Rutland, one to Eagle Bridge, NY and the B&M, and the Corkscrew to Chatham and the B&A. BTW, I'm not sure if "Corkscrew" was the official division name, but that's what all the Rut crews called it due to its terrible twisting grades between Bennington and Chatham.

    About the only Rutland order involving Chatham would have been for the "Rut Milk". This was a daily round-trip milk train that originated way north of Rutland, picking up cars all the way to Bennington, then going on to Chatham where it interchanged the train to the Harlem for a midnight-ish delivery to New York City. The empties from the previous night's delivery were then sent back up to Chatham before dawn where they were returned to the Rutland and northern Vermont. So I would hope to see something about this twice daily interchange at Chatham involving the three railroads.
     
  11. BoxcabE50

    BoxcabE50 HOn30 & N Scales Staff Member TrainBoard Supporter

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    I have orders, which by date should be Boston & Albany, but on NYCS forms, for Interlocking /Tower 65, 66 at Chatham. They seemed inconsistent in how that facility was addressed. I also have the same on NYCS forms (dated mid-1960's?) which should be well after th B&A was absorbed.

    And yes I have a Rutland from Chatham. It's addressed to Number 83, dated 1942. Is this a milk train as mentioned?

    Argh. We're walked off with the thread away from original intent. Sorry.

    Boxcab E50
     
  12. Hytec

    Hytec TrainBoard Member

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    Ken, the B&A and its name were kept separate from the Central until the Penn Central merger in '68, even though it had been leased by the Central in 1900. The NYCS form(s) you have could be for the Harlem, though the B&A may well have been using NYCS forms also.

    I don't know what number the Rutland assigned to the Rut Milk north out of Chatham, and I can't seem to locate the Harlem's numbers, either.

    I agree, we have sorta high-jacked Roger's hooping thread...sorry, Roger.
     
  13. LEW

    LEW TrainBoard Member

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    Box, Give you some maybe. CX,Warsaw,Wabash,South Anderson,Greensburg, North Vernon
    These names are all in Indiana. LEW
     
  14. fitz

    fitz TrainBoard Member

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    Ken, sorry I didn't respond sooner. I had to drive to Eugene to pick up our daughter and that sort of took care of the day. I won't try my home town as it was so small and few trains stopped there. The Mohawk Division included Albany, Schenectady, Amsterdam, Fonda, Utica, Syracuse. Lines East.
    Hank, the New York and Harlem was the first line, owned by the Vanderbilts, and if you see a photo of the original GCT, that railroad's name was featured on the center tower, with NYC&HR, and New Haven on the shorter towers. :tb-biggrin:
     
  15. BoxcabE50

    BoxcabE50 HOn30 & N Scales Staff Member TrainBoard Supporter

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    Well, my scanner/printer took a dive. So after fiddling forever, had to dig out an old one and battle it back into service. I'll try to get these up in a couple of days.

    Haven't heard from Roger as yet, but I can add to a page easily. (I have a little over 300 NYCRR locations, wish I had more!) So far what I have found to scan are:

    Gridley

    Wabash and Warsaw for Lew;

    Amsterdam for Jim;

    Interlockings 65, 66 for Hank.

    Any others?

    Boxcab E50
     
  16. rhensley_anderson

    rhensley_anderson TrainBoard Supporter

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    Gridley
    Marion
    Wabash and Warsaw

    Basically, anything on the Big Four Michigan Division between but not including Elkhardt and Louiville
     
  17. BoxcabE50

    BoxcabE50 HOn30 & N Scales Staff Member TrainBoard Supporter

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    Roger-

    PM coming your way with a question.

    :D

    Boxcab E50
     
  18. BoxcabE50

    BoxcabE50 HOn30 & N Scales Staff Member TrainBoard Supporter

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    Does anyone happen to have an NYC track map of Anderson, Indiana? If so, I'd sure like to see it! Reading through my paperwork reveals mentions of Anderson, North Anderson, South Anderson, South Anderson Yard- Aside from the offices such as Gridley, Taft, etc.

    Boxcab E50
     
  19. BoxcabE50

    BoxcabE50 HOn30 & N Scales Staff Member TrainBoard Supporter

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    The web page I promised is now up. Take a look:

    http://www.train-orders.com/TOUR/NYC/NYC.html

    If anyone has further requests, and I have them in my collection, it will be easy to add to that page.

    Please let other NYC fans know!

    Boxcab E50
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Apr 15, 2011
  20. fitz

    fitz TrainBoard Member

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    Ken, thanks for adding the Adams Center and DeKalb Jct orders. I had to go do some digging. Can't remember the last time I passed through DeKalb Jct, but I was probably a teenager. Engine 1067 might have been an Alco FA in 1965. Had to check Google and it says population 2213, so it appears that a small town still exists there. The Adams Center order addresses train 70. There was a 16-70 passenger train back then, and hold for extra 2851, in 1948, would imply power by Mohawk 4-8-2. Very interesting. :tb-biggrin:
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Apr 15, 2011

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