How many have live steam G?

LordPyro Sep 2, 2010

  1. LordPyro

    LordPyro TrainBoard Member

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    Was wondering how many people are into the live steam g-scale?

    We have gotten into it, and will never buy another electric steam engine again! It is so much more fun to run the live steam engine! We only have an 0-4-0 right now, but once we get our 7.5" scale steam engine, we will probably get some bigger engines and build an elevated out-door railroad.

    For anyone serous into narrow gauge steam engines, or even some standard gauge, live steam is great.

    The only down side is the curve radius required by the larger engines, only two Accucraft engines will navigate 24" radius, the other narrow gauge engines need 48" and some of their large standard gauge engines go up to 120".
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 2, 2010
  2. Stourbridge Lion

    Stourbridge Lion TrainBoard Supporter

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    Would love to see any photographs or video you might have of these in operation...

    :tb-cool: :tb-cool: :tb-cool: :tb-cool:
     
  3. LordPyro

    LordPyro TrainBoard Member

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    Here is the website that we buy all our live steam equipment from - they have photos of all the engines they sell (I personally enjoy American Narrow Gauge so Accucraft is a good bet), and some videos on their youtube page.

    I have the Accucraft Ruby currently, runs for about 15-20 minutes on a single fill.

    Sunset Valley Railroad Home
     
  4. DragonFyreGT

    DragonFyreGT TrainBoard Member

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    I'm not a fan of live steam, but I will be picking up a couple myself. First is the Accucraft Ruby for some practice which brings me to the only steam locomotive I ever fell in love with and that's Roundhouse Model's Darjeeling. That thing is adorable.
     
  5. LordPyro

    LordPyro TrainBoard Member

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    I guess it is a unique taste, but there is something about the real thing even as a model that makes other models (even with as much detail) seem lacking.

    The Ruby is almost unanimously considered the #1 starting engine for live steam, so I would say that is a good choice.

    As for the Non-US engines, the only ones that ever really caught my eye were the beautiful German BR52 and BR38 by aster, but all our G scale is American and mostly narrow gauge.
     
  6. sandro schaer

    sandro schaer TrainBoard Member

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    i have an accucraft ruby and a catatonk 38ton shay.
     
  7. EMD trainman

    EMD trainman TrainBoard Member

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    LordPyro, Welcome to Train Board and the G scale section. Yoiu are the 2nd G scale live steamer to join our board and glad to see you here. When you have a chance, please read this section here, it's geared up for new members and it will get you up to speed on our policies of train board > http://www.trainboard.com/grapevine/showthread.php?t=120938&highlight=newbies

    I have to admit I like live steam, but the expense is what keeps me away. There is a live steam club that puts on a display at the East Coast Large Scale Train show and it's fascinating to watch them. Those bigger live steamers seem to go for a while. They run alot of Accucraft products, but we were all amazed to see one guy running a real coal burning live steamer, that was something else.

    Believe it or not, the Warriror Run club which is a large scale narrow gauge club that actually calls thier scale Fn3 runs only electric Accucraft narrow gauge engines.

    The Ruby is a excellent engine I heard to start out in live steam as a beginner.

    EMD Trainman
    G Scale Moderator
     
  8. EMD trainman

    EMD trainman TrainBoard Member

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    Please Note: Sunset Valley Railroad is both a Manufacturer and retailer, I will allow this name to stay. Any concerns of my decision please pm me.

    EMD Trainman
    G Scale Moderator
     
  9. LordPyro

    LordPyro TrainBoard Member

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    Ah ok, well in my defense I didn't say anything besides that's where we do all our g-scale live steam purchasing from. :)

    Anyway, when I get home from school I will have to post some pictures here of our layout. Its not much, since our primary scales are S, and 7.5" scale. Speaking of which, I am surprised you guys don't have a board for ride on live steam, you have just about everything else :)

    It is amazing though that some have coal burning, I don't know how your manage a fire in such a small firebox. We are going to get our fill of coal firing though, as we have under construction a 7.5" scale 2.5" gauge 4-6-0 Rio Grande #20.

    Anyway, we really enjoy it, its a happy median between having to dedicate an entire day to going out to the large scale track and setting up, and the operation of a sizable scale s-gauge layout.

    But sometime next year most likely we are going to start work on an elevated railroad, a just large loop with 8-10' radius curves that we may expand on in the future. I would LOVE to have one of the K-36s by accucraft.

    And correct me if I am wrong, but I believe Fn3 is the proper notation for narrow gauge g-scale equipment.
     
  10. DragonFyreGT

    DragonFyreGT TrainBoard Member

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    Fn3 and F Scale seem to be bounced back and forth, I've talked to people who use either or. I guess it depends on the person really.
     
  11. LordPyro

    LordPyro TrainBoard Member

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    Probably just following the standard, Sn3, On3, Nn3, etc..

    although - by that logic it should be Gn3?

    Anyway, to get back on topic - does anyone know a good manufacturer of scale narrow gauge couplers? We have the old LGB style (not sure what they are actually called, they have the hook and the rectangular clipping area) and would like to change them out for better more realistic couplers.
     
  12. EMD trainman

    EMD trainman TrainBoard Member

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    I would more than welcome aboard live ride on trains to the G scale section. If there were enough members to join I would go to the Upper Staff and suggest a seperate foum for ride on trains, but we have to have active members first.
     
  13. EMD trainman

    EMD trainman TrainBoard Member

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    You are talking about hook and loop type couplers which is the only standard coupler in the G scale world. The Warrior Run club uses a manufacturer called Kadee. Here is the website link for the Kadee coupler page, many choices > http://www.kadee.com/htmbord/coupler.htm

    We have to remember that the reason why the designation Fn3 is used is because it was to describe 1:20.3 scale ratio. Just like Originally G scale is 1:22.5 scale ratio and Gauge #1 is 1:32 scale ratio.

    LordPyro, you would have to read our archives, but we generalize G scale from 1:22.5 scale ratio all the way to 1:32 scale ratio when in reality there is some more proper terminology to describe certain scale ratios. We actually had this long discussion post in the past, but it always confuses newbies to the G scale hobby.
     
  14. EMD trainman

    EMD trainman TrainBoard Member

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    F scale can be used to describe both groups below. The definition of F scale is trains that are 1:20.32 scale ratio. If you like the meric system better, F scale is 15mm = 1 foot.

    Fn3 Narrow gauge trains such as the Accucraft and Bachmann 1:20.3 scale traiins which run on 45mm Gauge #1 track ratio and alot of these models are commercially available. Remember to call 45mm track G scale is also really not correct terminology either.

    F standard gauge is mainline trains that run on 70.64mm track. These are mainly scratch built as there is no manufacturer that makes F scale mainline equipment.

    In the F scale world they feel this is the most realisti way to run mainline and narrow gauge trains, especially if you both on the same layout.

    If you notice in the G scale world we run both Narrow gauge 1:22.5 scale trains for example and 1:29 scale ratio trains on the same track.
     
  15. LordPyro

    LordPyro TrainBoard Member

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    Oh trust me, I know all about this concept. As we have both standard gauge and narrow gauge equipment for live steam.

    This is 7.5" scale, and the standard gauge is 1.5", the narrow gauge is 2.5". Which makes narrow gauge actually bigger than standard gauge contrary to how it would be in real life.

    I will put some pictures up tomorrow, I am to tired tonight to take photos of the layout.

    EDIT:

    I have uploaded some pictures of our g-scale, again its not much because it is not our main scale.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 4, 2010
  16. krs

    krs TrainBoard Member

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    F and Fn3 are not really interchangeable.

    The "F' designator by itself indicates a specific scale (same as H0 means 1:87.1 or N means 1:160 scale), the lower case letter or letter and number designation after the scale designation stands for the gauge of the prototype. If there is no additional designation, the prototype scale is assumed to be standard gauge.

    So F scale would be equipment in a scale of 1:20.3 running on (prototype) standard gauge track which would be 2.8 inch gauge for the model.
    Fn3 is also equipment in a scale of 1:20.3 but gauged for (prototype) 3ft narrow gauge track (ie n3) which is the 45mm track typical Large Scale trains run on.
    You can look up more detail on the NMRA web site.

    Large Scale equipment of different scales, ie Aristocraft, USA Trains, LGB etc. that runs on 45mm track has been given the designator "LS" by NMRA.

    NMRA seems to ignore the NEM (European model railroad standard) of II scale which is 1:22.5 scale.
    IIm or 2m stands for 1:22.5 scale running on (prototype) Meter gauge track. That scale and gauge also translates accurately to a model gauge of 45mm.
    Many European narrow gauge railroads are running on meter or 1000 millimeter gauge track, so for those the 1:22.5 scale gauge used by LGB is correct.

    USA Trains and Aristocraft at 1:29 scale and running on 45mm track doesn't really equate to anything as far as the prototype is concerned but that obviously never affected their popularity. MTH btw, is correct again when it comes to scale/gauge relationships - 1:32 scale of MTH on 45mm gauge track equates to standard gauge track for the prototype.
     
  17. EMD trainman

    EMD trainman TrainBoard Member

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    krs, please don't get the NMRA subject going again. The NMRA is still a sore subject for many G scalers as they did'nt even get involved into G scale until recently. I remember you wrote about the "LS" designation that the NMRA came out with. But in the mean time we were already going by the Garden Railroad Society designations before that. So I personally and probably alot of G scalers will ignore what the NMRA has to say about our G scale trains.

    I agree however that 1:32 scale ratio is the correct scale ratio to model standard gauge trains if you wanted a model that was close as possible to the real thing. MTH, Accucraft and a couple other custom train manufacturers model in this scale ratio.

    As you also stated the point that 1:29 scale ratio is not accurate in which I agree with that, but as me and DragonFyreGT stated before, we comsider 1:29 scale ratio the "FUN" scale ratio. It's the scale ratio where you just "Run 4 Fun" and who cares if it's not accurate. Plus the bigger size I think also helps make it popular.

    Note: Please for those who don't like the NMRA, don't not attack them with words here. A simple you don't like them will be fine. I will have to edit everything else out.
     
  18. krs

    krs TrainBoard Member

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    I'm not sure what you base your assessment on that G-Scalers are upset with NMRA at this time.
    There was an uproar when NMRA initially came out with a long list of new letter designations covering off every combination of scale and gauge that we had in G-Scale but they obviously listened and never implemented that.
    What exists today is the very best they could have done based on the reality of what exists in the marketplace.
    It's true that NMRA ignored G-Scale for many years, but even if they had gotten involved 20 years ago - it would not have made any difference. The scale/gauge "mess" (if you want to call it that) was caused by the manufacturers, not NMRA.

    Not sure what Garden Railroad Society designations you are referring to, can you post a link?
    All that comes up when I search for that are individual US and Canadian clubs and this UK site:
    G-Scale Society
    But the G-Scale Society uses the Fn3 designation as well.

    The term "G-Scale" was originally coined by EPL, the manufacturer of LGB, more than 40 years ago. From a scale/gauge perspective it was always equivalent to IIm (or 2m) modified to be rugged and robust to be played with by kids indoors and out.
    That was their target market.
    I can understand why NMRA didn't pay any attention to that - at the time it was no different than all the different "little kids" train sets in all sizes that you can buy at any toy store today. LGB certainly didn't start out as a "model" train and in many respects isn't really a model today - none of the G-Scale material is.

    When people ask me what scale I run, I now tell them "Large Scale" - that seems to satisfy everyone - it has a meaning in their mind - a "big train" with no specific scale reference. When I used the term "G-Scale" previously, many who knew a bit about model railroading assumed that meant a scale of 1:22.5 which in my case happened to be true but not true in many other cases.

    OK, I will leave it at that...........
     
  19. EMD trainman

    EMD trainman TrainBoard Member

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    krs, like your reply, it's expalined out well and very politically wrote out. Everything there does make sense. I believe DragonFyreGT make have the link for the Garnde Railroad Society, I will pm him and see if he can post it here for all of us.

    I may have misunderstood you, but I think you may have stated that none of the G scale material is really a model. I would have to beg to differ with the Accucraft 1:32 scale ratio trains, they are very precision made and correct to every detail and rivet. Most of them come in both live steam and electric versions. These also are priced in the thousands too. I think Berlyn locomitve works was another, but have not seen any American steamers done by them.
     
  20. krs

    krs TrainBoard Member

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    I mean "model" in the true and complete sense of the words.
    I don't own any Accucraft equipment, but I can see right on their photographs that the wheels are not models of the prototype. The flanges are oversized and the wheel profile is not accurate.
    I don't think one can create a true model in all aspects when it comes to G (as in Garden) scale. The environment just won't allow it - it's still 1:1.
    Running indoors only would allow the use of a true model, but then the model would be called II and IIm, not "G". Those models run on properly scaled track and proper scaled wheel sets.
    Not sure if there is a North American equivalent - I have never come across one.
    This is what I mean:
    IG Spur II

    By the way, they have their track and gauge standards as well.
     

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