The useful LHS. A myth or fact?

My LHS suddenly up and closed, but he had a decent selection of N scale. Barely any locos though. I ordered through his store because he was a Walthers dealer and I'd rather wait and pay the sales tax for two bottles of Polly Scale paint than pay Walther's shipping. Since they closed my only option is the internet or driving across the river to Augusta, since Hobby Lobby is planning to stop carrying everything but train sets

 

I lament the passing of the LHS, just as I lament the passing of the local unaffiliated pharmacy, the hardware store, the men's or women's clothing store, the shoe store, and the many shops that made each small town, or neighborhood in a city, so viable.

In Albuquerque, I visited the mortar-and-brick store of a large on-line etailer, but also the LHS that had supplied me for many years beforehand. I could easily drop $100-200 on detail parts (which they ordered) for a large ship, or for casting supplies.

Now in Ohio, I have two shops within 20 miles. I've used one this way: I'd like to purchase a 1:144 Fletcher with the best photo-etched and detail parts. There are a number of detail packages, and I don't have time to research this, so what do you recommend? . . . OK, please order them and I will buy it all when it is all together.

The problem with trains, I think, is that there is not that much complexity in ordering. A few engines, a few cars, some track--all pretty much commodity items these days. And commodity items have been traded on national markets for many decades. So the Internet is our train-related commodity market. If the technology is there, it is going to be used. I can remember when the stock ticker routinely ran 20 minutes late (or more). Now there are traders making money on millisecond delays between order and sale.

The LHS that survives without going online is going to be the store that offers consultative help rather than just retailing. Actually I think every shop has to be online is some way, but that is another argument. The consultative approach is happening in hobbies like RC cars and airplanes, where there is still a host of complexity, and a large element of human skill in controlling the beasts on the track or in the air. I'm amazed at the sophistication of RC racers: it just isn't there in model trains.

And I think that's why model trains will become mostly internet commodities, if they are not already.

 

My LHS is is only about 3 miles away from me and it is a 100% model train shop. Originally it only had O scale and HO (back in 1990)... but gradually expanded to N scale. Even though they are 100% trains (and ancilliary items... paint, scenery etc)... they can't carry everything... it would be prohibitively expensive with no guaranty that they will sell the merchandise. Excess inventory is a very costly expense that most hobby shops cannot afford. Even with reasonable discounting... some stuff just doesn't move in the local markets. Most good LHS with an internet presence and good following will be able to carry a larger variety of items... but not always everything. I buy from my LHS when they have things I want... but more often than not... I will go to the online shops because they are usually cheaper and are assured of having what I want in stock. The trade-off in sales tax versus shipping costs is usually 'a wash' unless I'm buying over $100.00 worth of stuff... then the online store wins there too.

 

I would PREFER to do my business with my local shops, and I probably do 50-50, but it got aggravating & here's why...........

one of my local shops (now out of business due to health) catered to a limited group & only ordered from 2 distributors ,so it took awhile to get what you ordered, but not a problem, as the service was great.
The other shop more often than not forgets what you tell him to order, sells it to someone else when it does come in, or neglects to order @ all...........he's nice & fun to hang out with, but forgetful.

I hate paying the outrageous shipping charged online, but it's somewhat worth it to get the exact stuff I want, when I want it, for a good price & limited delay.

 

Yes, it's a shame that the old time "mom & pop" hobby shop is gone. Even in this large city (Dallas), there is only one train store and of course they don't have everything. The online discounters are blamed for items not being stocked..an example. Bachmann On30 is not carried any more because a local internet seller has the stuff at prices below what the store would pay for "dealer net". And there are other lines that have been dropped also. The LHS does a good business since they sell on the net also so I am not worried about them. The other shops here carry trains as an afterthought and if you are looking for detail parts or the like..you are out of luck there. I have ordered stuff from "big stores" in other cities and sometimes may not get what I want for quite some time. What to do? I have began ordering what I need directly from the manufacturer. No, I don't buy RTR locos and cars, but detail parts mostly. I have had great luck ordering directly from Grandt Line and Precision Scale. I will call them on the phone and ask them if they have what I want in stock and pay with my debit card. The orders come to my door in just a very few days. I would love to go to the local store and buy what I need but I realize that they wouldn't want to carry parts for an O scale Shay or O scale mine car track in stock.
Just my 2 centavos. Woodie

 

I do, too, actually. There is no gold-plated rule that says that all businesses are run well. These guys are probably sitting around completely ignorant of the fact that they could be doing a lot better than what they are if they carried N scale and stock that was popular and/or related to the region they are in.

Generic hobby shops here are a dead loss. There is no reason for any model railroader to go near one, frankly. But we have some great train stores. Each one of them understands the need to compete, as well as the popularity of N scale. I like going there because they often carry things that don't look so great to me in photos, but in person they are wonderful--like Yesteryear Creation's windmills, for example. And then you've got Wig-Wag and Fifer Hobby that are also online, which is smart.

But for every 200 wonderful train stores it makes sense that there would be one that is a total waste of time, and I don't mind a bit if someone wants to complain about it. It's sad. No reason to jump on her or call names.

 

I wouldn't say I'm doing it to my economy. It may look that way to employees of LHS's, who I am sure feel left out. But the simple fact is that if I have to pay the kind of extortion prices my generic hobby shops in Santa Fe charge plus state tax, I just won't be buying things at all.

As an example, I went looking for a Badger 150 airbrush. The local hobby shops (national chain stores) that had them were charging TWICE what I could pay online. Our tax, over 9%, would have been WAY more than shipping. So would I pay all that money if I had no choice? No. Would I pay it just to try to keep those national chain stores healthy? Nope.

I often do pay more than I should when I shop at a local train store. But they are true local stores, I love that they are there, and I really do want to help out. Plus, they're charging what they have to--not actually extorting me.

 

You do realize, that legaly, (although nobody I know does it) you are still supposed to report online purchases and pay sales tax to your state for them.

This is bigger than just loss of revenue to the local shop. It is loss of sales tax to the state, loss of support jobs for the vendors and services that the shop uses. The picture is a lot bigger than many want to realize.

I'm waiting for some senator to realize how much money his state is loosing in sales tax to these purchases and push legislation through to end it. It was tried when the internet was in it's infancy but was shot down in favor of the growth economy. The growth economy is gone. And people wonder why the schools have no money. Most of the sales tax goes to support the school systems, at least in our state.

 

I see a lot of posts about shops not carrying "everything". I have to wonder, is it now that we have the internet we now know what "everything" is. Before that, our scope of knowlege was limited to magazine adds and what the LHS had in stock so we were fat dumb and happy. Now that it is easier to find all the options that are available to you, do you expect more than is actually reasonable?

 

I'm not sure you read my entire post. I was making the point that without online retailers, I would not be buying the items AT ALL--unless they are being sold by the local train stores, which do not charge extortionist prices.

 

There's something else to consider when buying from the LHS, especially high dollar items. Take Chicago/ Cook County for example, their sales tax if it isn't already is reaching 10%. So the Athearn BigBoy I paid $290 for gets almost $30 in taxes added on (I only paid $7 to ship it, no taxes). So if I had gone to some other shop that only did 10%-15% off or full price, I'm looking at paying around or over $100 more than what I could've. I can't justify an extra hundred to the CFO (wife) or myself

 

That's an interesting point. When I was a kid buying trains in Cook county, Athearns were in the $35-$40 range. $4 of tax isn't fun, but it won't break the bank either...Of course people in Chicago have always known that you drive out to Dupage to avoid the sale taxes.

 

And when that big-ticket item you want is being sold for 40% over suggested retail price, the 10% sales tax on top of it is just enough punishment to make you lose all desire for the product.

There was a time when stores tried to satisfy customers. For the past 30 or 40 years, national stores have been doing so well that they have completely forgotten about that. Now that the economy is bad, they are complaining. But if they choose not to control their pricing and figure out how to bring customers in, I feel no obligation to give their executives what amounts to welfare out of my disability check.

 

I support all hobby shops in the areas were I am working (I my job requires traveling) and still make many purchases on the Net as well.

 

Well, I just drove out to mainline trains in Forest Grove and he had a whole table of stuff on bargin basement clearence. Mostly HO. I spent $35 got 2 really nice Chip gons, an Athearn single well car and a Dummy Dash 9-40B in LMX that needs some love.

The Chip gons were LBF, Made in Roseburg Oregon. He clearly had a bunch to unload. They were $10 a car. Metal Wheels and Kadees installed. I may go back next week to see if he still has any.

 

Hiya Skip.

Please read my posts (and everyone elses) once more. We know that a LHS cannot carry everything. I am aware they cant even come close. But carrying next to nothing is not excused by "well they cant carry everything". Does the shop you work for keep NS and CSX locos on the shelves, along with other popular Ohio roads like PRR, B&O, NYC and Conrail? Rolling stock appropriate for the area? You may not have ALL of them, but I bet you guys have 3 or 4 of the 6. Thats why N works for you. You dont have everything, but you have enough goodies that most shoppers can find one or two things they want.

I want to support my LHS *or my not so local ones* but why on earth would I, when they do not have want I want, are generally not much help, I need to order the item either way, and can get it for less and not leave home? Both shops seem to be doing ok. My business will not make or break them, and if they wanted my business, they would carry N. Obviously they are unconcerned about losing the bit of the market that includes me. Thats OK. I have seen here that not all shops are run this way, and I have said that I am sure to the people in their market (RC and HO) they are quite a good place. I dont personally wish them, or any other LHS, ill. I just think that the attitude of "N dosent sell" is because they fail to try and sell it.

This part of Ohio is odd. Anyone that has been to the Kirtland Ohio Railfest show can vouch for the popularity of O here. HO is still strong too. N, at least here, is an also-ran for now. There were two very good N dealers there this year, though, which is a good sign. Hopefully N grows every year! Maybe N dosent sell well here, I dont know.

Wish i lived closer to your region. Would be nice to have a good shop to go to, with staff that knew a bit about trains, especially N.

Amanda

 

That whole "N doesn't sell" thing is maybe sort of true. If a given shop refuses to stock more than a small case of N scale, the N scale community won't bother coming in to shop and it will therefore not sell. One has to have a certain critical mass of stuff to get people coming in.

My LHS, which I consider a very good one, also doesn't have EVERYTHING, but if I go in there looking for something general like boxcars with roofwalks to run in a 1940s-50s consist I am going to be able to find a lot to choose from. They carry a lot. It takes a while to build up some inventory unless one starts off with a lot of initial funds, but they've got good inventory and people know to go there.