Ground Throw Problem

Hello All,

Have started replacing my Atlas switches with Caboose Industries ground throws. The first few went well, but I've run into a problem.

I have a left hand turnout, with another left hand turnout on the diverging leg of the first turnout. (Right switch machine in picture below).

The problem is there isn't enough room between the tracks to put the ground throw. Any suggestions??

Thanks
Kevin

 

I don't use caboose ground throws, but the method I use to tie a slide switch into a manual turnout, is very simple and effective. I think you can adapt it to your layout needs. Simply mount the ground throw close to the turnout. Run a piece of music wire, or even stiff brass wire from the throw bar on the turnout to the linkage on the ground throw. If it is more than a few inches, I would suggest running the wire through a brass tube, which can then be hidden with scenery, yet the wire can still move freely, without bending or kinking.

I just e-mailed a picture that demonstrates what I tried to describe. I didn't post it, as it is not my photo, or my work. It is what I used to adapt the method for my needs.

Eric

[ 08. February 2005, 14:07: Message edited by: pomperaugrr ]

 

I have used a plethera of CI ground throws on Atlas custom line switches. This allows me to put the ground throw on either side of the track. I can't tell you if you have that option on your turnout by looking at that picture. The custom lines have holes on both ends of the mobile rail for placement on either side. Bad case scenario is you'll have to use some styrene and rig the turnout to throw on the other side.

Or worst case scenario is pulling than turnout and replacing with a custom line. They run about $6-7, but will probably take some time considering the finished look of your layout.

 

Thanks to you both for the suggestions. I was wondering if it was possible to mount it on the opposite side of the switch. Didn't know if it was possible to glue on an "extension" to the non-switch side.

Like you say, worst case is I have to replace with a custom line. A year ago I would freak out at the thought of ripping something out of a finished section and replacing track, ballasting, etc. After having done it a few times, I've found out the repaired section is usually better than the old anyhow.

Kevin

 

The email I sent you has a shot showing the throws mounted well away from the turnouts with the linkages passing safely beneath many tracks. Let me know if you don't receive the e-mail. I'll resend it, if needed.

Eric

 

Eric

Got your email. That may work if I can dig under the ballasted track. Thanks.

 

If you soak the ballast, it should allow you to excavate the area, once the glue softens up. Good luck! Your layout looks like it is coming along nicely.

Eric

 

Yeah, I've had to pre-soak some spots when punching holes and mounting trees.

That hardened ballast can really tear up some fingers and knuckles.

 

Interesting you posting this question just at the same moment that I'm sitting here trying to figure out how to do the same thing.

The Atlas N scale standard switches only have the throw bar on the straight side of the turnout. On the curved side it's flush with the end of the ties.

On about half of the ones I want to convert to CI throws I can locate the ground throw on the straight side, so it's not that much of a problem. But the other half need to have the throw on the curved side (due to clearance problems).

I'm thinking of fabricating an extension out of styrene and glueing it on.

On the straight side, are you just dropping the lug on the CI throw rod into the hole on the switch throw bar?

If you come up with a good solution in the next couple of days, please post it. If I figure out what I'm going to try I'll do the same.

I have one added complication on my layout. I have a layer of foam under the track. So I can't nail or screw down the ground throw base. I've been a bit concerned about a method of fastening the throw to foam that will hold up under repeated cycling. My current plan is to glue the CI base to a slightly larger piece of styrene (to give me greater surface area) and maybe glueing that base down to the foam with Liquid Nails for Projects. Anyone else run up against this one yet, or have thoughts on my planned solution?

Regards

 

Ed, I really like the idea of attaching a larger piece of styrene to the bottom of the ground throw and then attaching it to the layout. That in turn can be scenicked and hidden quite easily. Man, that is so simple, but such a great idea. That way it keeps the adhesive (liquid nails) away from the moving parts of the ground throw. Did I mention I thought that was a great idea.

 

I have saved used Eskimo-Pie sticks for years. They are just right for mounting throw bars on, and thin enough to be of little problem to carve out a shallow trough to mount it in.

Cut to length, one end can rest against or glue to the bottom of ties, while the other end holds the throw, and in some cases the throw rod (wire) can run under the stick, so is hidden too.

Once painted, and a bit of ground foam sprinkled about, you can't find it.

If you run your wire through a Coffee Stir stick (or several in a row), buried like the wood throw stick is, the wire can work under several tracks without shorting out any of them, and the wire is kept from bending or kinking like a brass or aluminum tube would do.
(These are smaller in diameter than soda straws, are shaped like the figure "8", and have a hole on both sides that will allow up to a 1/32" diameter wire to slide easily. Cafe's and coffee shops give you these to stir cream and sugar with, because they are cheaper than having to wash spoons.

 

What a great thread, with great tips!

I use a one-inch piece of cork roadbed, glued to the foam, so that the throw is at the same height as my track, which is also mounted on cork. Then I glue the throw in the correct location with white or yellow glue--just enough so that the glue forms a ridge around the base of the throw. Then I drive two track nails at opposite angles through the cork and foam. While it appears flimsy, I've never had one come loose.

I use piano wire in a trench underneath the track for places where a throw won't fit between tracks, and also for locations where the switch would be hard to reach (at the very back of the layout.)

 

I use a similar method Pete descibes above. I use the cork roadbed as a base, but found latex contact cement works very well. I use a few track nails to add stiffness. A can of latex contact cement is not very expensive and can be found at any hardware store. I need to paint the ground throw tip bright yellow to make it readily visible. Aging eyes, etc...

 

(all code 80)

I have two Custom lines with ground throws, mounted similar to what's been mentioned. But what I like even better are the Peco spring loaded turnouts. The sliding part extends past the rails on both sides and has a little 'nub' on it (no holes) for attaching to a ground throw. But, with your finger you can easily just push the slider back and forth. No ground throw! The spring holds the rails in place. Looks good! Of course, this only works on track close to you.

 

Thanks to everyone for the help.

Ed,
I also have track mounted to foamboard. What I did was use some styrene I had for sidewalks that were scored (I think in 3 foot sections). 2 x 4 squares is just right for a base. Align the throw and drill 2 holes like on the throw. I then painted it with Polly Scale Cement color.

Then got the base and throw all lined up to the turnout and used 2 pieces of floral wire (or piano wire) to stick thru the 2 holes on the throw and base, down thru the foam. I removed the throw, lifted up the base and coated underneath with Walters Goo. Reseated the base and let it dry. Went ahead and patched the landscape around the base.

Set the throw on the base and trim the wires to be level with the throw. I then used a very small dab of Goo to hold the throw to the base. It seems to be very secure. For how long, I can't say.

PS - I tried a new signature , but it sure was annoying trying to read while train was scooting across the screen. Sorry.

 

Interesting suggestions, thanks. Now to pick which one I'll try to go with.


Crazy, the Goo sounds good. I have a tube, I had just imagined that it might eat the foam. That's why I was thinking about Liquid Nails. But the Goo would be much easier to use instead of screwing around with a tube and caulk gun. Are the wires just pushed into the foam, or do they have any glue/goo on them to hold in place?


Incidentally, talking about great timing, my February issue of MR just arrived this afternoon (I get my mail collected and forwarded from the border, so it's always a lot later than the rest of you guys get your issues). In the Turtle Creek article they are installing CI ground throws (HO) on Atlas turnouts. They use the cork roadbed glued to the foam base method.

Regards

 

Ed
Can't say how much Goo contacted the foam, there was a pretty good layer of foam, dirt, etc. above the foam.

I tried to get some Goo on the wire pins, but did not actually coat the pin. May try that next time.

Here's a pic of the first 2 I've done.



Mounted to the foam, I would say would be very stable. Mine are actually on top of about 1/4" of sand and foam that had been white glued in place.

Just noticed a post about the stupidest thing you had ever done. I may have to add this idea to that thread sometime, but for now is holding okay.

 

Just wanted to post a followup. My problem was trying to fit a ground throw on the inner part of a "Y". Eric (Pomperaugrr) had the best solution. I tried for 2 days to glue the end of the throw to the end of the turnout slide. Tried CA, Gel CA, Goo. Got nothing to hold very well.

Eric's suggestion to run a wire under the track and mount the throw on the opposite side worked very well. I was surprised at how good the wire worked. I am even going to do that on another place where I have room, but the "underwire" will put the throw in a more accessible position.

Thanks to all for the help,
Kevin