MTL losing their edge?

As always, well said.

 

Mark, you've done more than just that caboose! You are a certified kitbasher my friend, just look at your small steamer or that UP something-or-other you bashed. Really cool!

Mike

 

Well I think you guys are too good for me.

Take care.

Jason

 

I've read many of the posts and thought what the heck? here's my .02. I've been into the hobby for almost four years, far fewer years than a lot of you guys. I remember being frustrated at first that the models I thought were available didn't exactly match the prototype pictures that I had available. Then I realized that there was seemingly endless variety of rolling stock and seemingly endless variations of the same car. So, I decided if I was going to sleep at night, I better get over it. For me I am satisfied with a good representation most of the time.

I am a cheap skate so at first I thought M-T was pricey. But when you compare M-T to a similar example of Atlas, you can see the quality is better. The paint is sharper and details crisper. Then factor that its made in the USA. I started buying more M-T. If anything, I've noticed Atlas making an effort and successfully improving their detail quality. That is coming at a higher price. That all said, many models of any brand still don't match all protos perfectly.

Finally, I decided to have fun and try and create some relatively accurate models of protypes. That gave me a whole new appreciation for the art of modeling. My efforts resulted in far from perfect models. But there is always next time.

Hats off to M-T for helping to raise the bar high and challenge other manufacturers. I hope you continue to innovate so that we will all have great models to look forward to.

Dan

 

#1. Some people do run the mixed trains so you are mistaken there. Ever see that in real life?...........I have. Get out more and observe.
#2 It's ok to not like the "fantasy crap" as you call it, but it's also ok to like it.
It must not be your cup of tea.
#3 Overpriced?.......you really don't know much about manufacturing do you?
#4 Collectors aren't buying 'bunches" of cars like they used to....not MTL's fault.

 

MT sells many freight car parts

and caboose parts too. This is something positive. It is far too difficult to get parts from many manufacturers, but MT puts them into the stores.

There are two things that I wish MT would make available:

1. Couplers, coupler boxes and that funny shaped thing that holds them onto the power chassis for the FTs.

2. Spray cans of 'Factory Air', so that I can replace the Factory Air after I have opened a car.

 

1. Show me some pics. I probably do more railfanning than you do and I never see any of the presidents cars or battleships etc.
2. Thats right , not interested in the fantasy crap. Might as well play with lego's.
3. Yes they are overpriced. I don't need to know Jack about maufacturing to read a price tag.Compare MTL with anything that Intermountain makes that is comparable and the Intermountain will be a few bucks less and probably nicer too.
4. Then they should not make as much of the collector stuff and make more of what people want.

 

I think he is referring to the rest of the statement "Who runs a set of boxcars with U.P.? BNSF? CSX? " Perhaps a misunderstanding??

But is IMR's stuff mfged in the US??? If that's the case then either IMR is gouging you of MTL is very price competetive.

 

Dude, what did you expect? You slapped a guy in the face and you expect praises??? Remember, it was you who threw the gauntlet down.

 

Intermountain stuff is just as expensive as MTL stuff, it isn't made in the USA, it isn't engineered anywhere near as well as MTL stuff (most of their cars are glued together) they don't market their parts as well as MTL does (if at all), most of the Intermountain cars I own have crooked boxcar doors, etched walkways that aren't sufficiently adhered to the cars they are on, sometimes fall apart on arrival, and the only part on them that is dependable is their trucks, which happen to be Micro-Trains trucks!

Joe posted a reply to this thread a few pages back where he went on to explain why MTL produces so much fantasy stuff, and iterated how much interest there was in the battleship set, apparently, this is what people want.

It is difficult for a company to be everything to everyone, or to please everyone.

 

From all the years I've been at this, one thing is clear...enthusiasm comes in all sizes and flavors. We try to ride the middle and offer as much as we can to the broadest level of interest and I think that upsets folks who have a narrow focus in all this. What has surprised me the most is the level of anger directed towards us...like somehow we are forcing those folks to buy our product. I get plenty of email from concerned folks who what to partner in seeing us succeed and grow and offer suggestions, realistic suggestions about what we do and how we do it. That's constructive and worth listening to.

When someone calls your product and the earnest efforts of 80 people "Crap" then they loose the moral and intellectual high ground in their arguement and aren't worth listening to. Most of these folks have issues we as a group are not equipted to deal with, nor will ever be able to satisfy. They have an agenda or a need to have strangers think they are an authority because this is the only place they can do it. Sad really because it creates threads like this where we all wast a lot valuable modeling time banging our heads against brick walls constructed by internet bullies. If someone has a concern, lets discuss it and maybe we will both learn something. Call my work "Crap" and your opinon is meaningless.

Joe

 

Honestly guys, most of you that are bashing MT are piling on. If you like it for reason X. Great go buy one and make your hearts content. If you don't like it for reason Y, don't buy it and don't complain offer constructive criticism and move on.

Sales equal dollars. Dollars equal more money invested in business. Speak through your dollar. I have spoken through mine, and a proud owner of an MTL RPO and can't wait to get more of the heavyweight series.

For a car that's made in good ol' USA in Oregon, it get's the job done. It gets it done through having a phenomenal pricepoint at half of what it's competition is doing. It has a molded on mailhook, slightly deeper than flush windows, and off center bolsters, thats it.

I dont get half the detail with the Walthers Baggage and I have to buy a light kit on top of that.... Want to compare the Rapido cars...OK. Molded on grabs on the car body, but freestanding ones on the roof (slackers)...very poor design for a piece that is needed to be removed repeatedly (ie. the roof, the latches shear/wear easily)...the car interiors could have painted or at least molded in solid color...the PC boards need an additional light and a reflective strip otherwise they get a nice emerald glow...the wheel sets are out of gauge, oh and the trucks are not square (don't worry I have 5 that I've measured its not me)...and finally the bolsters need better engineering (or at least the screw loosened 1/2 turn).

In short for 15 bucks the MT RPO wins hands down when I dont have to do anything to the car to get it to work flawlessly. Yeah it has a couple of minor infractions to compromise to make a good pricepoint, oh and it's made in the USA.

Additionally if you look overall at the pricepoint of MTL cars, yes there are a few cars that go well and beyond acceptable pricepoints, but there are more that do not and by that I mean $10.00 - $13.00. When you compare them to IM or new Atlas cars, IMHO they still hold their own. Yes the details are molded on, but when I look at IM and the newer Master Cars the details are WAY too apparent. Too thick, too heavy.

Stop being bash happy. Accept it for what it is, understand that because of $$$ that manufacturers make compromises (even Rapido, Walthers and Kato), offer constructive criticism and move on.

The S.

 

I think you are right Tim I tried to pick up a few U.P. hoppers but all they released was one car. I wanted at least 12 different road numbers.

 

One thing that I have found works out pretty well is to mix that MTL hopper then with a bunch of hoppers from other manufacturers and run them as a consist. It looks far more prototypical, in my opinion, than running un-weathered, factory-fresh consists of all the same thing.

I often run a MTL Milwaukee Road hopper with some Intermountain ones that I have.

 

I kind of take offense to this. I'm sure you meant well, but it came across quite sharp. I took pride in collecting the Pepsi cars MTL offered. So what if there is nothing like that on the real rails. Pepsi is my favorite soda and the logo design is phenominal (something my field of study comes to appriciate), I chose to collect them because I simply liked them. Believe it or not, some people DO like that stuff. I also run steam, but you dont hear me complaining about manufactureres producing diesel "crap".

I think we all need to step back from our keyboards for a second and realize how silly it is for us to try and dictate what a major company does. Obviously they have people researching this stuff for themselves, and they wouldnt be doing it if they didnt have a reason.

 

mark,

With you all the way on that one, esp. since the collectors probably reduce the prices of the runners rolling stock more than they know.

Not only can't we control what the mfgs make, we can't control how others enjoy the hobby.

 

Wow, “crap?” Sounds like someone is bored and looking for online argument on a rainy day.

I’m not particularly fond of battleship or occasion cars, but most of us have had Economics 101. Kadee/MTL has been around long enough to be doing something right – selling what sells. If these ‘fantasy’ cars help the bottom line, then MTL is more likely to develop the cars I want in the future – more likely to HAVE a future. (Where’s my 1950s Mexican caboose, Joe?!)

To contradict what I’m doing, here, I havta say that I don’t think “crap” dialog warrants any kind of answer. Too low class.


Scott

 

Well since I started my new layout last year I could not think of a name for it.
But with this thread going on and on I have come up with a name for it.
Since 90% of my cars are from MTL I'm going to call it
Crap & Joke Central or C.J for short and if you think about it
"Cee Jay how many MTL cars are on my layout because I like them" .
Cool thing I like about model Railroading is it is your layout so you can do what you want with it.
Is my layout accurate,no there is no way it can be unless everything is scatch built on it.

Rick Peck (yes my real name) owner of the C.J. Central "Model Railroad"

 

I am also a little bit worried about the level of anger. It would be one thing if MTL had FORCED us all to buy their products and then produced a bunch of garbage. Overall, I think that MTL produces some very interesting stuff, some which I like and some which I will do without, and that same characterization goes for pretty much EVERY manufacturer.

I am not really into modern diesels, but I don't go off complaining about Kato releasing yet another SDwhatever scheme.

I think the RPO has a nice level of detail for a car under 20 bucks. Yes, the WOT Harrimans tend to have even more detail, but they also cost about twice as much each. I look forward to more releases from MTL, and I hope they keep the Heavyweight line going.

I would suggest to those who are angered to either find a part of this hobby that they enjoy and that doesn't anger them or to seek out some other ways of managing anger. To get angry about a company's offerings when you are not even compelled to buy them is unnecessary.

 

1. I was referring to road name, not fantasy. Does it really matter?
2. I believe you have been mildly admonished to forget those terms.. Just because it isn't your cup of tea is no reason to put down other's interests, which there seems to be plenty of.
3. Again, I'm not convinced that you understand the correlation between price tags and manufacturing. Manufacturing is a very complex process involving many steps and expenses. It is hard to make the bottom line look black when the costs of production are pretty steep sometimes. Seems that some have given examples of your favorite brand not being quite as nice as you would lead us to believe. I do know some particulars about manufacturing and you would do well to better understand the issues involved in manufacturing products. It isn't a cake walk and again it has been explained that much goes into the creation of products. I have my favorites too, but don't feel it necessary to belittle other products that I don't necessarily care for.
With that said, I admit that each person's opinion is subjective so we shouldn't put down other's opinions.
4. It isn't easy to determine what the masses will want or willing to buy. You can't please all the people all the time. And you and I are both aware that we modelers are a peculiar lot and have strange tastes at times.

Let's just let each other enjoy our fantasy worlds to our own heart's content.