NYC PT tenders with Dreyfus J3as

Discussion in 'Fallen Flags' started by RailroadUK, Jan 24, 2011.

  1. RailroadUK

    RailroadUK TrainBoard Member

    Dear All

    Can anyone tell me when the centipede PT tenders were introduced for work with the Dreyfus J3a Hudsons?

    I'm wondering if in the 1940s you would have seen them as part of the 20th Century consists?


  2. Hytec

    Hytec TrainBoard Member TrainBoard Supporter

    I'm speaking only from my ancient and limited memory, but I don't remember seeing any photos of tenders with the Dreyfus Century J-3's other than the original six-axle units. IIRC, the PT's were used predominately with non-streamlined J's and Niagaras on long-distance passenger assignments.
  3. RailroadUK

    RailroadUK TrainBoard Member

    PT tenders and Dreyfus Hudsons

    Hi Hank

    Thanks for the reply.

    I have found two photos on Google of Dreyfus Hudsons with PT tenders. This is a Precision Scale Company model depicting a Dreyfus circa. 1943 -

    I still don't know whether these tenders served on the Century though.

    Further comments/fasts from anyone much appreciated!

  4. Hytec

    Hytec TrainBoard Member TrainBoard Supporter

    I stand corrected. That loco is the Dreyfus design which was used only on the Century.

    Thanks for the photo and for setting me straight.

    BTW, that photo is of a 1:1 loco, not a model. :tb-cool:
  5. fitz

    fitz Staff Staff Member TrainBoard Supporter

    According to Al Staufer's "Thoroughbreds," the PT tender was developed in 1943, and eventually refitted to ALL of the Dreyfus Hudsons, so Yes, you could see the 20th Century Limited pulled by a Dreyfus J-3 with a centipede tender in the 1940's. :tb-biggrin:
  6. Mike Kmetz

    Mike Kmetz TrainBoard Member

    Yes, you would have seen the streamlined Hudsons with PT tenders pulling the 20th Century Limited.

    The J-3a Hudsons were equipped with PT tenders between 1943 and 1946. The tenders carried 46 tons of coal enabling them to run between New York and Chicago (or New York and St. Louis) with only one stop to replenish the coal. That would have been of great benefit for the 20th Century for keeping it on schedule. It is likely that the streamlined J-3as for the 20th Century had priority for getting the PT tenders for that reason.

    I checked "Memories of New York Central Steam" by Arnold Haas. An undated photo on page 273 shows streamlined J-3a 5451 with a PT tender pulling the 20th Century Limited. Below that is an April 1943 photo of streamlined J-3a 5453 outside the Beech Grove shops where it had just been equipped with its PT tender.

    There are probably other photos. These just happened to be in the first book I checked. Hope that helps.

    The caption under the photo of 5453 in Haas' book contained a small error. He said the tender was built by Lima. While 50 of the later PT tenders were built by Lima, this first one and 14 others were built in the New York Central's own shops at Beech Grove, Indiana. Alco built the 27 other PT tenders for the Niagara locomotives.
    Last edited by a moderator: Jan 27, 2011
  7. RailroadUK

    RailroadUK TrainBoard Member

    PT tenders and Dreyfus J3as

    Hi Guys

    Apologies for my tardinness in getting back to everyone and thanking them for their information.

    Fitz - I don't have that Staufer volume, but I'm thinking it would be worth getting.
    At least I now know when the PTs were introduced.

    Mike - Thanks for your contribution and obvious knowledge. I found a couple of photos on the web since my intial post, and you've given me some more to go on.
    As I said to Fitz I think I'll look out for a copy of the Staufer book, and I've just ordered a copy of Richard Cooks' "The Twentieth Century Limited 1938-1967"
    I just need now to get gold of a Niagara PT tender (Bachmann would be cheapest)

    All the best


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