ATSF Anybody got a date for this map?

TPWMAN Dec 1, 2008

  1. TPWMAN

    TPWMAN TrainBoard Member

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    bought it off of ebay.
     

    Attached Files:

  2. BoxcabE50

    BoxcabE50 HOn30 & N Scales Staff Member TrainBoard Supporter

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    Well, looking at those names at lower left- The SL&SF was reorganized as the SL-SF in 1922. The CM ceased operations in 1918. And the A&P I believe was was gone before 1900. These might help narrow time a bit?

    Boxcab E50
     
  3. cajon

    cajon TrainBoard Member

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    Boxcab is right & it's probably late 1800s given the RRs on the Map. But if you keep looking at the map there are lines going to places Santa Fe never went to like going thru St Louis to Chicago. And wasn't the line to old Mexico traded to SP to get into CA? You might do a browser or google search for RR maps to see if you can find your map. Is it a reproduction?
     
  4. TPWMAN

    TPWMAN TrainBoard Member

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    I dont think it's a repro.It's pretty delicate.the auction said around 1900 but the seller was not sure excatly.
     
  5. r_i_straw

    r_i_straw Mostly N Scale Staff Member

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    Hard to give it a date based on the railroads shown. The route out of Pueblo, Colorado was only built as far as Canyon City where the DRG and ATSF settled out of court that the Santa Fe would go no farther in 1880. The Atlantic & Pacific pretty much ceased to exist by1897. And then it was only on the books to retain its land grants. A 1900 map shows things quit different than those on the map in question. I would say it was a lot of pipe dreams published in the 1870s some time.
     
  6. BoxcabE50

    BoxcabE50 HOn30 & N Scales Staff Member TrainBoard Supporter

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    Maps were used to promote the RRs and sales. Lines showing boldly, which are not owned or subsidiaries, were often "friendly" connections. Or meant to show they could ship your goods by a very direct and swift route, from point A to B. They were after your business, and these were just one of the tools used.

    Boxcab E50
     
  7. SSW9389

    SSW9389 TrainBoard Member

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    Notice Ancona, Illinois on the map? That point is where the Pekin Branch took off from the Santa Fe mainline. This was a part of the old Chicago, Pekin & Southwestern promoted by Francis Hinckley. Santa Fe bought this line in December 1886 after it had been renamed the Chicago & St. Louis. Santa Fe completed its Chicago Extension on April 29, 1888 when it began running trains on this route. I believe the portion of the line below Pekin, Illinois might be either connecting lines or the projected line of the C&SL. From Page 56 of Joe McMillan's High Green to Marceline.
     
  8. SSW9389

    SSW9389 TrainBoard Member

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    The line to San Angelo, Texas was completed in 1888 by the Gulf, Colorado, & Santa Fe. From Warbonnets and Bluebonnets by Joe McMillan p. 112.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Dec 2, 2008
  9. SSW9389

    SSW9389 TrainBoard Member

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    The San Francisco and San Joaquin Valley was purchased by the Santa Fe on December 9, 1898. From Valley Division Vignettes p. 15. The trackage shown above Bakersfield on your map is all Southern Pacific. I am also sure that if the SF&SJV had been started that it would be shown on this map, it is not. I would say your map dates between 1888 and 1895. Still have a few more Santa Fe books to check.
     
  10. r_i_straw

    r_i_straw Mostly N Scale Staff Member

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    Definitely no later than 1895. That is when the Santa Fe unloaded all its interests in the Frisco and Colorado Midland which are listed on the map.
     
  11. topgoz

    topgoz TrainBoard Member

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    What is that number in the lower right-hand corner? Perhaps a document number? Maybe BNSF's marketing or historical section (if there is such an organization) could bounce it against company records and give you some insight.

    The worst thing they could do is laugh uncontrollably at the idea of you thinking they might be willing to help....
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Dec 2, 2008
  12. jagged ben

    jagged ben TrainBoard Member

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    According to this page the Colorado Midland became independent of the Santa Fe (again) in 1894.

    The SL&SF and CM were both bought by the Santa Fe in 1890.

    So, between 1890 and 1894.
     
  13. SSW9389

    SSW9389 TrainBoard Member

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    Another clue on your map is Prescott Junction in Arizona. Prescott Junction became Seligman. The rail line shown on the map going southward from Prescott Junction is the Prescott and Arizona Central. This line was in service until 1893. The Santa Fe competed its own line to Phoenix in 1895 called the Santa Fe, Prescott & Phoenix. An 1895 map would prominently show the line to Phoenix as it does in Santa Fe . . . Steel Rails in California book by Donald Duke and Stan Kistler on pp. 16-17. Prescott Junction data from The Santa Fe Route Railroads of Arizona Volume 4 by David Myrick.
     
  14. DRGW_hero

    DRGW_hero TrainBoard Member

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    Narrowing it down.

    Well, Judgeing by my Area In colorado. I'd have to call this Before 1970 for sure. Just because they have No trqacks North/South on the Colorado Front range.
     

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