I know I said 60 foot and thats what the carbody length is if measured over the buffers. They have been referred to as 65 footers by many myself included. That said anybody know about when Bmann stopped production on the seemlngly rare 60 foot observation cars? And for that matter when did they stop production on the coach and combine units? I was working on a project when I pulled out of my car box one of these old Bmann obs. At first I thought it was something I had bashed years back and had forgotten. Then when I could not find any splice marks I decided to refurbish it and use it for a train of shorties I am working on