Another good lookin loco that is Brass and not plastic..... Imagine 4 of these pullin a freight through a cutting on the club layout? [ 21 March 2001: Message edited by: virtual-bird ]
You'd be very lucky if you can get even 2 brass locomotives to run well together let alone 4. Don't "pine" for brass, because of it's high price many people assume it's the best but believe me, it isn't. Many of the folks that own it will sing it's praises and I think they do this just to make themselves feel good about shelling out all those bucks to own it. I own many brass locomotives and I have slowly started to unload them on ebay. My position affords me the means to buy as many trains as I want and I much rather have plastic models than brass anyday, if for nothing else the availability of parts is 1000% better for plastic models than brass.
The only brass engine that I own is an Overland Genesis (waiting for the Kato one). It is the worst engine I have ever owned, in terms of running performances. So I have relegated it to its green box. It's convenient, however, when taking pictures of my layout, but surely not to pull my Amtrak train. Hopefully I have a Life-Like F40 (yes!) which is much more able to pull my Amtrak train than the Overland Genesis. Good luck with these engines! For sure they look good but regarding running (and especially pick-up) quality, it's another story... Jean-Louis Simonet visit traiN'ternet: http://www.trainternet.org/
<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by swissrhb: You'd be very lucky if you can get even 2 brass locomotives to run well together let alone 4.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> Thats what I meant... I would buy them from Kato or Atlas or even LL.... But wouldnt wee wee on Brass crap. But aint it a nice looking unit?!
Whew...you had me worried there for a minute Bird!! I thought you done got converted to brass...and after all those long discussions we had about it!! I'm glad to hear that you are still safely on this side of the fence!! I liken brass and plastic to my other hobby: playing music. There are bands that look really good, but who can't play music to save their lives, and there are the guys who just aren't as good looking, but boy can they play!! And the cost?? Get real!! Sorry, but there is no way I'm shelling out that kind of dough just so I can say I have one. By the way Bird...how is that layout coming along?? Haven't heard from you in a while. Happy Modeling!! John
I will never understand why anyone would shell out all that momey for something that, with the exception of the clunky hand rails, is so finally detailed and yet has a drive that can't out perform a cheap Model Power Locomotive. Trust me, I would rather spend the money on an Atlas, Kato, Life-Like or Bachmann-Plus/Spectrum and add $15.00 worth of details, paint and decals to make it look as good as the Brass Loco. Sure, there are some Locos you can't get in Plastic and are only available in Brass. That's OK, I can wait until someone else makes it in plastic or do without.
Brass prices lets them only be accessible to those with sufficient disposable income to not care. Unless the brass is of a model which there is only one of (such as a brass Royal Hudson in HO), to run a couple of consists using brass is out of the question. What is the point of owning only one SD40 unless the line you are modeling did just that. Now before I get critiqued loudly, I am aware that I - like you - will only own one SD40 or whatever because that reflected how much money I had available at the time. With the release of SD90's, I would like to own five or more, but when you decode them and pay in Canadian dollars, the bill will come close to $1000. Now when you factor in the fact that I also have to spend money on the layout to get it up and running, well...that compounds the problem.
Hi All, I have been following this thread with some interest but as I am a modeller of Swiss railways I have no idea of the sort of prices you guys are being asked to pay for brass engines.On average how much more expensive is a brass engine over a similar plastic one? I do own several brass locos, most of which are steam and never likely to be made in plastic. Fortunately, mine run well but I do accept the statement by another member of this forum that he would do without rather than pay brass prices. On a modern era layout steam locos are not essential (mine are models of prototypes that still run as museum locos)but some of the common everyday Swiss locos are only available in brass for N-scale so if you wish to create the right atmosphere it is much harder to say "I will do without" My modern image brass locos run equally as well or better than the offerings from the major European manufacturers but do cost about three times the price. As I said earlier, I do not model US railroads but I can see, during visits to model shops, that far more is available from the major manufacturers for US N-Scalers and at prices far lower than we pay for European models so I can imagine that the urge to enter the world of brass must be much less. I am not complaining as it was my choice to model the railways of a small European country with limited appeal....I just wanted to point out that sometimes there is a valid reason to purchase brass. Take care. John.
Brass costs Hundereds of Dollors more than Plastic per unit! If you can afford it, they run good and it's the only version of what you want, then by all means buy Brass. I'm thankfull that I'm not in that boat.
John, over here in the U.S. BRASS is like owning a Rolls Royce automobile, it is a status symbol. If you are wealthy and own one or more Brass locos, you are to be bowed down to, and to have several of the big engines, you are practically worshipped by the magazine editors, and supposed to be revered by the poor folks who can only afford 30 or 40 plastic ready-to-runs. For instance a B&O EM-1 2-8-8-4 F/P Crown as delivered costs $1,500.00 American money, cash, no monthly payments. a SP GS-2 4-8-4 Daylight F/P with can motor is $695.00, and for cars, a 48 seat coach is $309.00, a hopper car is $247.50, and a steel caboose is $185.00. You have the advantage in that your equipment is built by master craftsmen so runs "Like a Swiss watch" as well as looks like one. The Brass we have to put up with is made in the Orient by poorly paid day laybor, sometimes just kids eeking out a living, while the company scams the rich Americans, because the Americans will, for some reason, pay the price. Sorry, but you asked, and that's the truth.
John, I used to model Swiss Railways in HO scale, and really loved it. But the models became so pricey, and sometimes difficult to get what I wanted. I had met the general manager of Fulgurex a number of times at Gauge one meets in England, and so on one of our visits to Switzerland, my family and I got to visit the Fulgurex offices and collection in Lausanne. The brass models made me drool, but the prices were way too high for me to even contemplate. The quality of Swiss brass is very high, much better than US models, it seems. However, I am very pleased I eventually settled on American N scale, but will not contemplate buying any brass, as I have not yet seen any perform nearly as well as the majority of plastic running today. Brass locomotives look great sitting in a siding, though
Since this topic seems to cover Brass engines, I thought I'd announce that the order I placed in Jan. 2000 has finaly arrived! My friendly Hobby dealer just called requesting the pick-up money. IT'S HERE in N-scale ! 'Key Import' PRR T-1 DUPLEX 4-4-4-4 Can't wait to see it pulling a string of PRR lightweight passenger cars or a long coal drag. I've had good success with my other brass....PRR M1-a and PRR DD-1. I'll sure let the train world know just how good it is? The price is more than I paid for my first car in 1960 eek!! Don't tell the wife! ...Eddie Picture of the actual model enclosed.
WOW! I love how this thread is going. There have been so many interesting points brought up. Sorry but I have to jump in here again and comment on one of them. Someone said that the European brass is of much higher quality than the brass in the USA and that statement is only sometimes correct. You see, most of the European brass such as Lemaco, Fulgulrex, HRF, Ferrosuisse, etc. is also made in Japan and Korea. The only difference is how the importer "manages" the run. The builders of brass (especially the Korean builders from what I hear) are notorious for putting in the cheapest components they can find as soon as your back is turned. If you are an importer and you hire a builder, you need to plan on visiting the builder at EVERY stage of the production run. You must insist that they have your approval BEFORE they go onto the next stage. This is the only way to insure that you wind up with a quality run of models. By the way, I have nothing against the Korean people and I am not looking to get into any sort of ethnic battle. I am merely passing on what several importers have told me. Anyway, it seems that the European brass importers are better at "managing" the builder but the point is that most of the European brass is built in the exact same places as the American brass.
New here and a brass steam runner. this last message had a very serious point to make, just because someone built it doesn't mean you have to buy it. this goes for plastic as well. Atlas's new BQ23 is a case in point. It is a piece of eye candy just like most of the lastest brass.
BQ23? I don't want to step on the toes of a new member, but what BQ23? Atlas has a B-23-7 and it is certainly NOT eye candy. It is a fine running and detailed locomotive at a reasonable price. Sorry to disagree, but I do. Anyway, we Welcome you to TrainBoard! [ 22 March 2001: Message edited by: Maxwell Plant ]
Didn't Seaboard or a CSX predosesor Have a GE B unit, mabey a B23-7 that had a huge wide cab on it, I think it was called a B??-7Q. Ring any bells? Kevin
Hey Squirrelkinns Welcome to the TrainBoard! I am really interested in your Brass engines! Tell me which ones you have, and how they run? Did you have to re-work any to get them to run well? You can e-mail me direct too. Have you found any change in quality in Brass over the years like I have? What is a BQ23 is that a diesel or steam engine? Eddie, that is a neat looking T-1. Are you going to weather it, or run it? I thought the T-1's were only used on fast Passenger runs. Did they have enough traction to pull coal? Let us know how it does, and I know you are thrilled with it.
Watash, Yeh the PRR T-1's were developed to pull high-speed Passenger runs. They could run 100+ MPI with 900 ton train. They had too much slippage with the dual gear arragement and weren't used for freight. The on-coming Diesel put it to rest by the early 1950's. I had to have a T-1 to finish(top-off) my collection of PRR Steam(13 in all). I was born and raised in Altoona, Pa during the 1940's and 1950's and my idea of PRR is always going to be Steam power. The T-1 had a traction force of 58,300 lbs. and with addition of trailing booster trucks, 73,300 lbs. Not anywhere near the highest power the PRR had. Yeh I'm going to run it with 11+ passenger cars of that era. I may build a additional main line to my current double mains to give it room to run. ? Another summer project. I've learned to get more traction from the brass engines by working with my PRR M1-a. I found getting the weight over the main drivers was a must, so I shimmed up the rear under the cab giving more downward lean to the front. It seemed to offset the upward pull of the motor and the uplift of the drivers.? I'll have it here on the rails by end of next month. ...Eddie
