I think some grade crossing accidents are the result of sheer stupidity( seeing the train and trying to beat it, or assuming nothing's coming) and others are the result of absentmindedness brought about by cell phones and car stereos. I'm not advising we ban these things, I know I use my cell phone while driving everyday. However, I know more than once, I've missed an exit because I got a phone call while driving. We just have to learn to PAY ATTENTION.One night about twenty years ago I was driving down a dark divided four lane highway. Ahead, I saw what appeared to be somebody waving traffic around a stalled car with a flare. I changed lanes and almost ran into the side of some very dark, black hoppers moving about 5 mph. It was raining and I had no idea there was even a crossing there. Since then, a gate and flashers have been added.
The situation that takes the cake from an in-cab standpoint is when they do try to outrun you across the crossing (sending a very eery chill up your spine) and they just barely make it, the first thing they do is flash you the middle finger as you pass at 55mph. I'm not sure what kind of gesture they could come up with after your engine clips the rear of their vehicle sending it spinning god-who-knows-where and how far. One other note of interest is how when someone does survive one of these train vs. car encounters, they say "I just didn't see the train". I let you be the judge as far as the culpability of that statement most of the time. Mail8
Back in the days of steam,it was different in many ways, one being we were behind 3 or 4 hundred tons of machinery, where today you are right out in the front with EVERYTHING behind you. The sucidal trying to temp you to squash him was more often than not blotted up from several different places, than kicked out of the way. The idea of a "cow catcher" has come to mind several times. Maybe pushing a scoop type snow plow would simply chuck these idiots off somewhere out of the way and not derail the engine. The TV is now showing some very "toned down" views of crossing accidents, that I think may help some, but probably if real video of these wrecks were shown in schools, the kids would grow up to have some common sense and not desire to end their life by foolishly tempting an engineer to "try and catch them". It is the thrill of the race, out run something, even if its the Devil with a permanent trophy for the looser. ------------------ Watash #982 "See you in the Pit"
well unfortunately the carnage continues, 5 people have been killed at a level crossing here in New South Wales Australia. Here is the news report http://news.ninemsn.com.au/national/story_7809.asp At this stage there is no suggestion that the lights and bells were not working. ------------------ Regards Paul #1-Moderator & Member number 50 SPAD Investigator #1 ICQ 61198217 http://users.bigpond.net.au/railroad2000
Pierce, I don't exactly remember how old I was, maybe the second or third grade, one day my dad and momwere downtown Wichita, Kan. and dad suddenly said, "Watch out"! Mom and I looked around, but nothing was close. Dad said "See that street car coming"? and as he said it, the car got to us and went on by. Then he told both of us, to remember how far away the street car was when we first saw it, how small it looked. Think about how really BIG it was when it got here, and how quick that was. When the light changed, we started across the street as another street car was coming from the other direction, and was about the same distance from the intersection. It made a lasting impression on me and I have never had a narrow excape, and I'm 70 now. Show the kids how small it looks half a block away, then walk them right up to it so they can touch it and see how BIG it is. Have them try to push it. Everyone! It isn't running, but maybe they will remember it. ------------------ Watash #982 "See you in the Pit"
Great idea, Watash. The more dramatic we can make this safety issue, the better. Your father's demonstration had that drama and that is what a child will remember. He had you experience the situation instead of just telling you about it. Thank you for sharing this with us. ------------------ Peirce Behrendt Southbury, CT peirce@ibm.net
I can remember in grade school attending a Look Listen Live lecture. They also discouraged us from placing pennies on the rails. Where I live ex-Southern branchlines to Cherokee lumber, Alcoa, and Anderson lumber are rarely used. Many people get accustomed to no trains at these crossings. Despite the periodic rail traffic, we have not had a vehicle/train accident in Maryville or Alcoa in recent memory. Im sure the case is different where rail traffic is stronger in both cummuter and main line service.
This is from one of my posts in another thread "I read somewhere that it is difficult for the general public to accuratly estimate the distance or speed of an approching train. This is largely do to the large size of a train relative to things that we are used to estimating (cars and trucks for example) any way this study came to the conclusion that most of these people can clearly see the train coming - they just think they have more time. " As for racing the train: Don't these people realise that if they wait, they get to watch the train!
You mentioned about putting penneys on the rail and watch a train flatten it. My dad told me one time that if a penny was placed tight up against each drive wheel of a locomotive, that the engine could not move. Because it can not generate enough power to lift its own weight. Some years later I did just that. I used my pocket knife blade to make sure each penny was snug against each driver. The engineer gave her a little throttle and nothing happened. He leaned out the window and glanced at me then gave her some more, but nothing happened, then he climbed down mad and asked me what I had done to his engine? I told him, and why, and that if he would back up it would go. He did, and it did, and we became friends. He pulled it on one of his buddies later. Dad had warned me not to put a penny on both sides of the wheel, or the engine would be trapped and I could get into a heap of trouble! I don't know if this stands good on diesels today or not, but you can't even walk across railroad property now to find out. Back then engineers were friendly, and taught us about how to be safe around the yards, so none of us even got hurt. There is no way to teach kids about it today, talk goes in one ear and out the other with no resistance at all! We'll loose a few young, then they'll grow up and we'll loose some more. There needs to be some easier way of cleaning the blood hair and eye balls off the tracks though, it makes some trainmen queezy.
You know, my dad told me the same story Watash! I've always fancied trying it sometime...but with nickles It's kind of amazing to think that an engine capable of pulling a bazillion some odd tons of stuff over hill and dale can't even climb over a measly 1/8th inch piece of metal!
I always thought this was urban legend - but as I think about it now, if you stick the penny right up next to the driver you are asking the engine to climb a very steep (yet very short) grade.
Yank, it is also the leverage, (moment arm) the engine has to develop to lift all its tons straight up to the heigt of the penny's thickness (about .050") without going foreward. So it has no momentum to assist. Yes each penny MUST be tight against each driver. Any foreward motion will add the tonnage of the loco to the mass in motion. Remember "A mas at rest tends to remain at rest, and a mass in motion tends to remain in motion?" That is why trains tip over on un-banked curves, requiring super-elevation to maintain higher speeds by keeping the center of gravity between the rails at all speeds. Tyr turning suddenly to your left on a bicycle without leaning to the left as you do.
I was thinking about some of the things said on here about people crossing the tracks with the gates down. They are extremely stupid and honestly guys if they are that stupid to talk infront of a multi-ton machine going any miles per hour maybe we should thank the crews that take them out. The engineer shouldn't feel bad about hitting them because there is just nothing you can do. Trains can't stop on a dime. Operation Lifesaver is a wonderful program They do a wonderful job in educating the public. I know they go into schools, how about the older folks? Like High Schoolers in Drivers Ed or older adults? Just an idea. Take care Ya'll.
This is about a Pedestrain and a train Accident. Some of my statments are very graphic in nature. My college Railroad teacher showed me a grim(VERY GROSSOM) short movie. I think more or less to scare me into giving up railfanning and doing it from a good distance away. Becuase when I railfan I am within about 20ft of the tracks and I am BY MYSELF. I can very easily move away from the tracks myself than trying to have a friend to yell at to move away also. I don't want to be the cause of an accident because my friend did not here me to move. Anyway back to my Story My teacher showed me a very grussom short movie. I imagine some of you have seen it. It took place in aurora IL on the triple track main. It showed people moving off the metra train going home from work. The gates were down on the road crossing people were walking across the tracks and some were looking to make sure there was no trains coming. Then my teacher pauses the tape and says pay attention to the women getting ready to cross the tracks. Then he played the movie again. The lady walks down off the metra train and starts to cross the tracks and got hit by another commuter train on the next line doing 70 mph. Needless to say this was an unedited tape it showed the impact. The person who videotaped this was hit with the body after the train made contact. I always take precautions and I am very diliberate when I am around the tracks. I know what I am doing at all times. I don't feel like ending up like the lady. [ 18 May 2001: Message edited by: Jack Doran ]
<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by BN9900: I was thinking about some of the things said on here about people crossing the tracks with the gates down. They are extremely stupid and honestly guys if they are that stupid to talk infront of a multi-ton machine going any miles per hour maybe we should thank the crews that take them out. The engineer shouldn't feel bad about hitting them because there is just nothing you can do. Trains can't stop on a dime. Operation Lifesaver is a wonderful program They do a wonderful job in educating the public. I know they go into schools, how about the older folks? Like High Schoolers in Drivers Ed or older adults? Just an idea. Take care Ya'll. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE> That's true up to a point BN. For instance, yesterday two small girls, about 8 or 9 yrs old sprinted right toward my train at a crossing and stopped inside the gate at the last possible second. My heart was in my throat because I knew if they stepped out there I would surely hit and probably kill them both. Not all trespassers are suicidal idiots. Some just plain don't know any better and getting splattered is a hard way to learn a lesson. That's why I strongly support Operation Lifesaver. From my point of view, you probably can't save the morons who don't have any sense of self preservation anyway, but for the ones like those little girls, maybe it can help them live through the learning experience instead of having it kill them. I highly recommend OL to anyone who has any interest in preventing trespasser and crossing injuries and fatalities.
Jack, that film was shot by a local railfan in Downers Grove Illinois, I know this doesn't have anything to do with your story, but I just thought I'd post that as an FYI, I lived on that line for 18 years and remember hearing and seeing that footage on the news the night it happened. Rule 281, I respectfully agree with you, I was thinking more along the lines of older folks who know better...but as we all now, there are exceptions to every rule
Jack, is it possible for me to buy a copy of the unedited tape your RR Teacher showed you of the Aurora, Ill. incident? In trying to educate people, especially kids, it does not seem to sink in by just talking. Their mind shuts down as soon as the thrill, sensation, excitement, or whatever is shut off. Most comments were that, that was a staged add for the company! No amount of explaining could convince them they could not have simply stepped back out of the way...because...the kids were convinced she was NOT killed, she was paid like a model! The "show" stopped "Just when it was getting good" was the attitude. They felt like they could play chicken and get away with it, and that the add was just that, an add! Kids now days are used to blood and gore, shootings, stabbings, car wrecks, air crashes, and train wrecks. All they want out of life is fun, party hearty now while you are young enough to enjoy it, because they see no future for them selves. They freely admit that when their chum got shot, it surprised them. When asked why, the reply was, "well, when Elmer Fudd blew a big hole in Bugs Bunny, Bugs just healed up and tied Elmer's shotgun in a knot." Ha Ha, general laughter. I think they should see what actually happens to a body when it is hit by a train, or has to be wiped up out of a car. The news media always cuts that part out, so that actual death is not real to them, its no more than what they see in cartoons and Dungens & Dragons, just "play-like". Most of these kids have no serious concept of danger. They have no closeness to family, so they miss no one, they care only for their own pleasure. Not long ago, a man tried to convince an audience that one day these "Hippies" would be running our country, well, we saw what that was like for two terms! Like the man said, one day "these airheaded kids" of today will be running our country if it still exists. If these teenagers don't care, then why should we grieve when we splatter one? God help the little ones!
Watash those unedited ones are very hard to find. But try news organizations around Chicago, or like Green Frog, I think they have that on one of their tapes. Good Luck.
