Hi All: Multilevel Layout or Not?

Hello,
I am a model railroader that is getting back into the hobby. Like most, I got an TYCO HO set for Christmas when I was nine. However, I felt that I was to "Grown up" for trains as I became an older teenager. Now that I am retired, I have found myself trying to get back into the hobby(I've been "trying"for five years now). I've been collecting locomotives and rolling stock, and working on a track plan for some time now. The problem I'm having is that my wife is restricting me to my 9' x 9' den/workshop to build my layout in. My present track plan calls for three levels with a helix connecting the levels. The top level has a logging camp and logging operation. The middle level has an interchange between the woods line, and a branch line. and the bottom level well have the SP yard and service facility at Klamath Falls, Oregon, as well as some other trackside industries.
My problem now is that the more I look at my room and my track plan, the less convince I am that I want a multilevel layout. Does anyone have any suggestions either way? or is there another option that I may try? I need to make sure that I leave room for my workbench and toolchest, so that I can do maintnance on my rollingstock, as well as work on my wood ship models, with room to move around.
I'm open to any suggestion that you all may have.

Thanks,
Ralph Y.
Clinton, UT

 

I feel your pain.

A 3 - 4 foot diameter helex will provide a decent grade to allow medium sized trains (about 20 cars with two locomotives). I would suggest using a book shelf with re-positionable shelves to test the height of each level you choose to build. Don't forget to place buildings, trains and a tree or two to give you an idea of what you are looking at. Also take into account the space needed underneath each shelf for electrical and lighting. In regards to your work bench you might want to consider a "roll a way" work bench. Something on casters you can roll under your layout/ against the wall while operating the layout. Also if there is an adjacent closet to the room you can build the helex into the closet there by saving space for the Right of Way.
Good Luck! Hope this helps!
Also check out youtube. There are many great layouts out there as well as here on trainboard too. Do your homework for a few weeks and you will be able to get a lot out of your space.

 

Welcome to TB Ralph. Glad to have you aboard.

 

First, welcome to TrainBoard!

Second, I am a multi-level layout nut, so take that into account when I say "YES!" to your question.

At 18' x 9', my room is exactly twice the size of yours, but I am going with three levels (two with scenery + staging on top) because I could not realize my goals on just one level in a room that size. If you are considering a multi-level layout, I highly recommend the book [ame="http://www.amazon.com/Designing-Building-Multi-Deck-Railroads-Railroader/dp/0890247412"]Designing & Building Multi-Deck Model Railroads[/ame] by Model Railroader magazine's Tony Koester. This is an excellent book loaded with photos and ideas taken from lots of multi-level layouts, many from his own NKP layout currently under construction. I just purchased it a few weeks ago but wish I would have had it two years ago before I started building. One of the layouts featured in the last chapter is a multi-level HO layout in a spare bedroom with two long bridge scenes and two town scenes.

Also, check out this website:

BC Dawson Creek Subdivision in N-Scale
http://www.bcrdawsonsub.ca/

This layout is being built by Tim Horton, who posts frequently on the forums here at TrainBoard. It is a multi-level layout in a 13' x 11' bedroom that packs in lots of scenery and operations. This is an ideal example of a multi-level layout in a smaller sized room.

Hope this helps! Looking forward to having you on board.

Jamie

 

When I retired I began building my layout around the walls of my family room with a 79 foot mainline run. But with having to span two door openings, (one four foot and one six foot) and not being able to have a continuous run during the winter due to my woodstove being in the way, I moved the layout up to a small 10 foot X 9 foot bedroom. It is constructed based on the N Trak One track design being 1 foot wide, single track with passing sidings a double ended yard and several industrial areas, with a 34 foot main line run. There is a closet in the room which will house a 6 or 7 turn 36 inch diameter helix going up to another level with another 34 foot run. The bottom of the lower level benchwork is 38 inches above the floor. I have made room under it for a workbench and storage shelving for materials and books. I also reversed the entry door to avoid the door swinging into the room. There is plenty of room to move around and have a couple of people in there. The duckunder is tough on my knees but it is in a corner industrial area where a lift up or lift out was not suitable. A multi level layout is the only way I can get a good run length and satisfiable operations and would do it again if I had to.

 

Welcome to Trainboard.

First- I have a one level layout.

I chose not to do a multilevel because of three reasons.

1. I was concerned with the space required for the helix.
2. Access to all parts of the layout.
3. Height required for working on and viewing the layout.
4. Perspective. There will be little vertical perspective changes in relation to a one level layout for viewing and for photography.

But, each to his own. Plan carefully first.

 

Welcome aboard. Whoooo Whooo!

I am also contemplating a move next year, and thus a new layout. Among the considerations is a multi level layout to "pack in" as much as I can.

If I may, I will suggest against, since you say you have been planning for five years and not got started on construction. That sounds typical, and frankly, layout building takes a long time for most of us, and I think you would be in that category.

So, you need to balance getting running fairly quickly, the need for bullet proof bottom levels on what seems to be essentially your first layout, maintenance later, your age, etc. against what you will really pick up in terms of added operational or construction interest. Multi level layouts are not just twice as difficult to build, they are probably 3 or 4X harder.

I have a large layout, with a lot of hidden or hard to access track to support an incredibly complex operational scheme that to this day I haven't implemented. If you think that scenario is a possibility, then I would opt for simplicity of a single level. Based on my experience, I think you will be happier because most of us dream about more than we ever really do in this hobby.

A single level layout with no grades and no hidden track usually runs well. I think if you pare your wish list down a bit, you can certainly do two levels at most, and if you pare it down to your essentials of logging and one interchange, you might get away with one level and be operating soon.

If possible, perhaps you can leave an area for the helix and after having completed the first level and running it for a few years, leave the option to build the next level, but be sure NOT to have a track plan that requires both or all levels to be functional. Otherwise, you might be in your grave before it gets operational!

Just my 0.02 from 20 years in N and 50 years in the hobby.

 

Welcome, Ralph.

I have a 13'x6' layout with two levels. I had my heart set on a helix when I began, but I gradually realized that it would be too hard to clean and also I just wasn't willing to give up the extra space. It's really nice to be able to have my workbench and supplies all in the same room. I wouldn't have been able to do that with a helix.

So my top level, just low enough so I can reach over it to the backdrop, is one layout, and my lower level, just high enough so that I can pull up a stool without knocking my knees, is the another layout. I'm REALLY happy with that--because now I can model two different layouts in one room! I am going to build a kind of removable, lock-in cartridge to connect to one end of each level: I'll run cars onto it, then carry it to the other level and plug it in, and take the cars off of it. That way if I want to, I'll be able to run cars all the way from one region to the other: apples from Wenatchee to Santa Fe, for instance.

But like Jeff said, one wants to actually get somewhere with a layout before one is in the grave (or too rickety), and that is on my mind, too. Right now I'm wondering if I will ever be able to lay the track and wiring on the lower deck. (The benchwork is finished). I think I would have had plenty to do for the rest of my life just to have the one level.

 

Welcome to Trainboard !

I am on the fence for this one.

For myself, I wish I had built multiple decks for more run lenght but I couldn't afford the extra cost involved.

For someone new to building a layout, I prefer the "kiss" method. ( keep it simple stupid )

For a seasoned modeler, anything goes.

The room is small and a helix will eat up space. But with 2 or 3 levels, you gain run lenght. Double edge sword here.

If your good with carpentry, I say go for it. But if you are not, I would stick to one level.

Craig

 

Thanks All

Thanks all for your thought provoking input. I am leaning more towards the multilevel layout. Fortunately I live in an area where there are several skilled model railroaders who are more than willing to help me in the construction of my layout. the reason I haven't started construction sooner is do to some serious health issues, but now those are mostly behind me so now I can get started. Also, for the past few years I've been involved in helping another friend work on the layout of another friend thus learning some inportant skills. I have a friend who has designed a removeable helix that can be stored when not in use. I also have permission to set up a removeable staging yard in the hall, provided I put it away when I'm not running trains. I am planning to build the layout in phases, starting with the lower level first, so that I can build the lower level this year and run it for a year or two, then start the next level, etc.
My sister works at the Klamath County Museum, in Klamath Falls, OR., and she bought me a book that has plattes of the the hall wh Southern Pacific's Klamath Falls Yard, including the locomotive service facility, roundhouse and car shops. This is going to the centerpiece for my lower levels. also on the level will be a hidden run around staging track to run mainline SP trains, and the Klamath freight and passenger stations. Branching off the main will be the Oregon, California and Eastern line as it heads east it serves a box and door plant, a bulk oil distributer and some agriculteral businesses. From here the train will enter the the helix to the second level where the line will serve a potato storehouse and grain silos and a stock corral then branch off to enter Weyerhaeuser's Sycan Yard. Sycan Yard will have three tracks, a baloon track and wye, and a RIP track with an adjacent farmhouse barn and blacksmith shop. From Sycan Yard, Weyerhaeuser's Woods Line enters the next helix to the third level. On the third level the line will pass a turnout that leads to a gravel pit. Next the line passes another turnout that leads to a construction camp where a crew is busy building a right-0f-way. The line meanders up and enters Weyerhaeuser's Camp 6 complete with Yard shop and sidings. from the camp, various lines lead to logging areas where crews are busy falling, bucking and loading logs on cars.
I am scratch building two McGiffertt Loaders for use on my layout, as well as the buildings most of the buildings that I can find prototype pictures of. Having grown up in the area, and having most of my family still living there, it's not to difficult to find pictures of alot of the buildings.
As I start construction, and as it progresses, I look forward to sharing it with all of you.


Ralph Y.
Clinton, UT

 

One more thought FOR multi-level layouts. I have three levels planned (two levels with scenery plus staging on top). I may or may not ever get to the upper levels; for now I am working on the lower level exclusively. With a temporary staging track where the helix will be, I will have a fully functional layout on the lower level only. However, I have all of the benchwork in place for the upper levels when (if?) I get to them. Jamie

 

Just to chime in for the helix: I set up one helix with a "middle entrance". It does take a lot of space and so I wanted to make maximum use of it. The primary use is to connect a lower level with the upper level (the lower level does not yet exist, the upper level is the layout so far), but since it is there it is also used as a part of the upper layout. Which means that on the upper track, trains enter the helix, go down one full loop and then leave the helix to continue.
Operationally it caused no problems since a couple of years, no derailments, but the helix parts is the steepest grade of the layout (about 1.5%).

Pictures can be found here on my Railimages space, see the link below ("some pictures").

 

I think helixes (or more properly, helices) take up too much space, especially in a 9 x 9 room. I designed what is called a nolix in a 10 x 23 space. This gives me three levels on one long wall and two levels on the opposite long wall. I don't know what is possible in a 9 x 9 space. I use the front edge of the tables for show, and the rear edge to climb along the walls from level to level. It allowed me to put 1100 feet of track in a single stall garage, of which 700 or so is the mainline run. I have about 340 sq. feet of table in a 230 sq. ft. room. Check out the links in my signature below for more details.

Welcome to Trainboard!

 

to some people, a 9x9 dedicated space for a layout is just a dream. if i had that space, i would modify one of ian rice's shelf layout plans from his recent book "shelf layouts" and just build a really great, one level, round-the-walls layout.
i'm no expert ... but wouldn't a helix in that space really eat up a lot of real estate?

 

Yes, it would, but there really isn't enough run length for the grade between levels without a helix. Even with the helix, you get a substantial gain in layout area.

 

Ralph, I have a 15x9x9 u shaped layout with 40" turn arounds at each end on a single level. I like the single level concept because i like to run long trains with a working yard for both freight and passenger. I also believe that helix takes up too much room in a space like mine or yours. Whatever your choice have fun.

Dave