C-WW I decided to get my new Athearn 2-8-2 running last night. The DCC harness that goes in the tender was much stiffer than the last one I bought and was steering it off the track on curves. I bent back and forth for a little while to loosen it up and then bad things started happening! It would stop and start and then just died. I found that the black wire was loose which I understand is a track pickup wire. Does anyone have any experience in repairing these wires? I understand getting the shell off is 3/4th of the battle. This harness is not the best design and clearly effects tracking, I hope the 4-6-2 doesn't have the same problem. I sent Athearn an email about the problem but haven't heard back. So far, my Bachmanns are less finicky than these engines!. - Nevin Wilson, FM&P division of the B&O [ March 28, 2006, 02:39 PM: Message edited by: watash ]
<font color="336633">im sorry to hear about your 2-8-2 Firstly id give Athearn another Email, they normally (from my experience) reply to emails the same day. Secondly if you can see where the wire come from is it in a delicate part to solder?? I have never had one of these so i dont know how to take one apart but im sure there is someone here that has</font> ------------------ Matthew wheres all the C636's???? stickymonk.com Matts Photo gallery TrainBoard member #257
You have my sympathies. I had a problem in which a Spectrum 2-8-0 wiring harness pulled free from the pickup wires. After months of waiting and phone calls to a somewhat less that helpful parts dept, I soldered the &*%$ thing myself. I haven't dealt with Athearn yet, but I have heard no complaints from any friends about them. ------------------ The Southern Serves The South!
Actually Athearn sent me an email today saying that they want to fix it themselves and to send it to them ASAP. It will go out to them tommorrow. I have asked them to loosen or remove the shrinkwrap around the harness. - Nevin
When you get it back, add some weight to the tender. Also MR ran an article about a year ago that included directions to dissassemble the locomotive. Good Luck, ------------------ Union Pacific - Hawaii sounds nice until you realize there are no trains.
" MR ran an article about a year ago that included directions to dissassemble the locomotive. " I've tried to find information on how to open up my 2-8-2 Athearn Mikado and haven't found any. Can anybody "walk me through" it from experience? I need some weight in there but don't want to tear into it without knowing what I won't have to take apart.... Mark
I'm at my office now and do not have access to my layout books, yes I've taken the 2-8-2 apart and actually put it back together without too many parts left over. If you e-mail me I will remember to send you the directions. Regarding the stiff wires, I use SoundTraxx decoders in all my steam and have found some of them to be stiff and experienced the same problems you do. I've found ultra soft wire, I think it's from micro mark. and have replaced the wires from the loco to the tender with those. I also got some neat pins from Tony's Train Exchange. I glued the female ends on the bottom of the tender, and they work very soomthly. ------------------ When in doubt, empty your magazine. Member #33
<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Mark_Athay: " MR ran an article about a year ago that included directions to dissassemble the locomotive. " I've tried to find information on how to open up my 2-8-2 Athearn Mikado and haven't found any. Can anybody "walk me through" it from experience? I need some weight in there but don't want to tear into it without knowing what I won't have to take apart.... Mark<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> Here are all the notes I've collected on the Athearn Mike. Kind of long but should get you going. Have fun. Athearn USRA 2-8-2 Shell Removal John Engstrom Athearn, Inc. 19010 Laurel Park Road Compton, CA 90220 It appears that in some locomotives the screw holding the main frame, boiler and weight (the screw that goes up through the bottom of the frame at the stack) is too tight, causing the frame to lift. They say that by backing the screw out a little, it should realign the frame and alleviate the problem. Additionally, however, we have found that the wiring harness that goes into the tender can cause problems IF it is not straightened out and flexed a little. We have been able to eliminate the problem with the harness in our testing here by straightening out the wires, then flexing it to get the wires inside the shrink tubing loosens up. We don't think that the derailing issues is an inherent design issue, as we have received very few complaints (less than five, to be specific). If you can back out that screw and solve the derailing problem, that is great. If it does not solve the problem, please send the locomotive to me and we will fix it here. Regarding removal of the boiler, here is how we do it. 1. Take off the cab . . . a. lift the rear of the cab to release the two rear tabs (small screwdriver carefully inserted at bottom rear of cab will help) b. insert screwdriver at front side of cab between bottom of cab and walkway and carefully spread side of cab away from boiler to release small tabs at front bottom of cab (much easier to do than to describe). c. lift cab straight up and off of boiler. 2. Remove smokebox front and unplug two wires (use sharp tweezers to pull plugs straight down). 3. Remove the boiler to pilot deck supports (we'll get the correct term for future use) 4. Remove screw from bottom of frame that goes up into stack 5. Insert screwdriver at rear of boiler above walkway and carefully pry boiler rear upward. Do this on both sides to release the tabs that hook the boiler to the walkway. 6. THIS IS THE TRICKY PART . . . after rear of boiler is released, lift rear of boiler to clear the weight, then CAREFULLY slide the complete boiler forward. May need to wiggle it as you slide it forward. Boiler comes off, and you have the innards exposed. 7. To take out motor and boiler weight, there are four screws to remove. Two screws are at rear, with red and black wires attached. Two are on each side near front of weight, above walkway, just behind centerline of axle of first driver. Take out these four screws and motor/weight assembly comes out. Here is some more general information for you. The wiring harness of the Genesis Series USRA 2-8-2 Light contains nine (9) wires. They are used as shown below: Gray Motor negative Orange Motor positive Red Right rail pickup (engineer side) Black Left rail pickup (fireman side) White Forward light Yellow Reverse light Blue Light common Green Function 1 Violet Function 2 Note that although the yellow, green and violet wires are included in the shrink wrapped harness, when used with DCC they would probably be separated from the wiring harness and kept in the tender. Both Lenz and Digitrax (and there may be others) have advised that they have DCC boards that will plug right in to the wiring harness. Please contact them direct for more information. Lenz support@lenz.com 978-250-1494 Digitrax support@digitrax.com 770-441-7992 We aren't recommending any DCC company, and there may be others who have (or will have) boards to fit this plug. We hope you will contact your favorite DCC company. In closing, we hope that this information will allow you to correct the derailing problem with your locomotive. If it doesn't please send the locomotive to my attention for repair. John Engstrom Athearn, Inc. 19010 Laurel Park Road Compton, CA 90220 Subject: Re: Athearn Mikado Question From: sobieck@aol.com (Sobieck) Date: 15 Dec 1999 23:50:17 EST The goo suggestion is a good answer. Last night we debated down at the club why the Athearn mikado will not pull as much as it should. In addition to the goo suggestion, we came up with several others: 1. Instead of goo, black latex paint was suggested for one of the drivers. 2. The springs in the pilot and trailing truck may be too stiff, causing the model to "lift" off of the tracks. 3. Possibly adding more weight in the domes if possible, and using pencil lead type weights to slip in next to the existing weight. 4. Try balancing the model on the center and see if the weight is properly balanced over the drivers. If it isn't you can try and correct for it by trying #3. Remember to try it with and without the springs on the pilot and trailing truck. Subject: athearn mikado's From: ccam986451@aol.com (CCam986451) Date: 05 Jan 2000 23:01:05 EST I got one for Chirstmas, NKP 586, wife got the right one. I' ve been reading all the post on this subject since they come out. Went thru the front screw and loosen up the pig wire. I ran it around the lower level on the layout for about five days to help break it in somewhat. I had no problems with it until I started to run up the helex (3 1/2 turns, 30 in. rad.1 1/2% grade). I could pull 10 cars and caboose and no more, but I have to switch at the top swith forms a reverse loop on the upper level and noticed the front drive wheel off of track everytime it came up to this switch, so I checked the switch and drive wheels with the nmra gage and thing was ok. Keep watching train going up but never came off track at the same spot, different spot everytime. Put engine on workbench and took boiler shell off, and as posted before engine was heave to the back. Took weight off , and add moldable weight between clinders and sand dome, as posted. With weight off I remove front board for headlite ,won't use changing headlite, and cut 15/16 in. off the weight at the front and rewired the loco so only have two wires to tender for speaker for sound. Made cardboard insert for inside of boiler reassbled boiler and put boiler insert in to it meet end of weight and poured in 3 ounces of templow in the front of the boiler and put front truck back on and put engine back on track. Ran engine and cars backup the helex and no more front wheel off tracks, and now the engine will pull 20 cars an caboose up the helex. I' m well sastified with this engine now. ------------------ Union Pacific - Hawaii sounds nice until you realize there are no trains.
Thanks for all the information from everyone. I think these locomotives are capable of pulling much more than they seem to do out of the box. I think that the stiff harness is a major reason for the derailments but that bending it like I was doing is risky and can lead to broken wires. I hope that the 4-6-2 uses a ribbon wire or something more flexable. - Nevin
Thanks for all the information on the 2-8-2, it'll be put to some good use! I'll be adding some lead to the boiler area to solve my problems I think. I'm not sure if I'll cast it or "mold" it with a hammer and stuff. I'll have to melt down a small piece to get it started. Anybody have an idea on a maximum amount of weight I should add to it? Or is it possible to add too much weight? I'll also look at the spring-loaded wheels. The springs seem a bit tight, so that might be part of the troubles as well. I too have had problems with the tender derailing. For me it was mainly when backing up, especially onto a particular siding. I "re-bent" the cable going into the tender and that helped. I still don't like the idea of such a heave cable going between the engine and the tender. In my opinion it's looking for trouble. I've heard of people adding weight to the tender to help solve this problem. Not a fan of that..... Thanks everybody! Mark.
<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Mark_Athay: ...adding some lead to the boiler area to solve my problems ... cast it or "mold" it with a hammer and stuff. I'll have to melt down a small piece to get it started. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE> Use A-line Moldable lead weight. Shapes easy with your fingers, no mess. Just wash after handling. <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR> Anybody have an idea on a maximum amount of weight I should add to it? Or is it possible to add too much weight?<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> Not enough room to add too much weight to the 2-8-2. <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>I've heard of people adding weight to the tender to help solve this problem. Not a fan of that..... Mark.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> A little weight in the tender is just what the doctor, or in this case the engineer ordered. Don't know why everyone is so hesitant to add weight to the tender - think about the prototype. It helped solve my problems and the operational benefit surely outweighs the loss of 1/2 a car you might be able to pull by adding 1/2 - 1 ounce of weight to the tender. Also adding weight to the tender will reduce your desire to sit there and flex the umbilical until you break those small wires. It's your railroad, do what you want - but ADD WEIGHT TO THE TENDER Have fun. ------------------ Union Pacific - Hawaii sounds nice until you realize there are no trains.
UP fan, I am not an engineer, so I may seem a little dense. If the engine is the object slipping what good does it do to add weight to the tender, or for that matter anywhere on the engine except directly over the drivers In my old stock car days we wanted all the weight we could get "sprung" any unsprung weight was "bad" ------------------ When in doubt, empty your magazine. Member #33
Chris, I think what they are considering is that extra weight in the tender should help keep the tender from derailing on turnouts and sharper curves,(because of the stiff wires) and could assist in electrical pickup on the tender wheels. I usually wrap any wires between engine and tender around a small dowel like a coil spring, to provide for flexing. (There is less strain on bending a long wire, than a very short one.) I have often wrapped my motors and frame in pieces of business card stock, covered with suran wrap, cleaned the inside of a boiler, re-assembled it and dropped lead B-B's in every space they would go. I just glued them in place. The layers of card provided ample clearence to prevent shorting, and the engine was really heavy. ------------------ Watash #982 "See you in the Pit"
<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by ChrisDante: UP fan, I am not an engineer, so I may seem a little dense. If the engine is the object slipping what good does it do to add weight to the tender, ... <HR></BLOCKQUOTE> Watash hit the nail on the head. The extra weight in the tender balances the stiffness in the umbilical between the tender and locomotive. In a perfect world you would only want the tender weighted to NMRA standards for any car which is about what I recommended adding. The extra weight in the tender will not increase the pulling power of the locomotive but will help keep everything on the track. Have fun. ------------------ Union Pacific - Hawaii sounds nice until you realize there are no trains.
<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by watash: dropped lead B-B's in every space they would go. I just glued them in place. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE> Try finding lead BB's these days..... Ever since they outlawed lead shot you can only find steel or tungsten shot. Moldable lead is an alternative, or cast and forged lead for us "hard heads"...... Mark. P.S. I'm getting ready to cast some lead for a new Athearn AC4400-9W I just got. My visibly smaller Proto SD-7 weighs more than it and can out-pull it. Kind of sad don't you think?
Mark_Athay, I had purchassed a ten pound bag of lead shot gun shell shot just as I stopped making custom ammo re-loads, so have plenty, and I also went to a plumber's supply and picked up another five pounds of plumber's lead sticks and blocks. The B-B's are not the .177's, they are only about .093" diameter. I did melt some pattern wax (for lost wax casting) and pour that into a plastic boiler once, then lifted the motor and frame out just before it hardened. Then I put the boiler in the frige to get cold, and then lifted the wax out. I took that down to a foundry and had them make a lost wax lead casting, that was even heavier, but it was a problem making supports to hold it up off the motor. Pouring glued shot is easier and except for a few ounces, works as well. The thing to remember is be sure to lay the suran wrap down onto the plastic shell (boiler or diesel), as cleanly and tight against the inside as possible with no holes or splits. That allows you to lift the wax, or glued B-B's out after the glue dries. There is always something that needs adding or trimming, then you can glue it back in if you want. I like to have it removable in event I wish to change motors, or add DCC. Another thought, I used to go out to the fireing range and shovel dirt into a screen, and re-claim lead bullets, until I found I can simply buy plumber's lead. ------------------ Watash #982 "See you in the Pit" [This message has been edited by watash (edited 24 January 2001).]
A real good source of lead powder is from golf club repair suppliers. They make a lead powder that is poured down shafts to change the swing weight. It would work as well as lead shot. It is toxic stuff however. I had a patient eat some of it once- definitely not good for you. Check out Golfsmith or Golfworks web sites. - Nevin
<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by NevinW: a good source of lead powder is from golf club repair suppliers. - Nevin<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> Thanks for the information!!! It'll be easier to use in cramped quarters than pouring or forging blocks of lead. I just added 8 ounces to an Athearn diesel last night, not a lot of fun, but good for venting frustrations from the office. Mark.
Lead shot is alive and well, just go to a gun store that sells reloading supplies. Watash, did you used to break those poor little clay birds with your big nasty 12ga. I'm a member of ATA and will be in FL for at least a week of the Chain Shoot next month. You gave me a good idea, but what about #7, 8, or 9. Are they too small, I would think they would migrate all over the place. How do you glue them fast enough to stop them from flowing all over??? ------------------ When in doubt, empty your magazine. Member #33
They are not too small Chris, you want them to flow everywhere, you need the weight! I coated the inside of the suran with contact cement. Dumped excess, sprayed again, filled, dumped, etc until no more would go in. Then it dries for three or four weeks. It was carefully lifted out, suran removed, and re-coated good with glue, and allowed to dry in air. I re-loaded special ammo for the Officers in my area, and the Del Rio Border Patrol. I hunted deer, and many rabbits and prairie dogs, no targets, no clay. ------------------ Watash #982 "See you in the Pit"
