I'm researching a west Texas shortline and I'm at a loss to find out how they turned their engines around at the end of their run.I have Sanborn maps that show a reversing wye in their originating city but then the engines (1 Mogul and 1 Consolidation)proceed for 38 miles to one town and then another 27 miles to the next town,further north.On the Sanborn maps of the two other towns no evidence shows a reversing wye and definatley no turntable existed on this railway (they were to cheap).Therefor my question is...would it be feasible to run a steam engine as much as 65 miles in reverse?I understand that steam engines are built to be uni-directional but I just can't see how they did it otherwise...any suggestions?Or other possibilites that I'm not aware of? Mucho Gracias, Gene Jackson
It was quite often the practice to run steamers in either direction when turning was not available. The only governing factor, was track condition. The tender was not expected to "track" as well at high speed, as was the pilot truck of the engine. Reverse running was always at lower speeds. Occasionally giant mountain pushers were run in reverse when traffic was heavy on some class A roads. The whole train was not pushed in reverse, the engine always pulled the train regardless of which way the engine faced.
That may be true Watash,BUT then why the reversing wye in the originating city?Granted this also appearantly served the interchange with the M-K-T and the T&P as well as the Cisco&Northeastern.I guess what I'm trying to figure out is perhaps the Sanborn maps don't show everything..has anyone else come up with that same assumption?or problem? Gracias, Gene Jackson
Hey Stepchild! As a matter of record, the FRISCO ran its engines down branch lines all over Kansas, Oklahoma & Texas tender first, or reversed. There was no shame in running that way, and the Home shops of the Frisco designed their tenders with clearance for viewing. Many were built with the head brakemans dog-house behind the coal bunker, and many ran clear view style, or look-a-likes behind their steamers. Frisco loved to run 4-4-0's, 2-6-0's, 4-6-0 "Berry Picker's", and 2-8-0's on the shortlines. Even Russians made it too! All running tender first! Frisco short-lines, and branch lines for all intensive purposes only had run arounds for the engines. Few Wye's or turntables existed outside of production/engine facilities! Frisco was one of the sharpest railroads that ever existed- THEY VALUED THEIR EMPLOYEES UNLIKE ANY OTHER-LISTENED TO THEM TOO! I NEVER HEARD A FRISCO MAN COMPLAIN ABOUT THE COMPANY! THEY HAD THE CLEANEST, FASTEST, MOST ECONOMIC ENGINE FLEET EVER RECORDED IN RAILROADING HISTORY, AND THAT'S A FACT! Those were REAL RAILROADING days, when everyone was serviced by rail!!! Take Care! Randy SLSFFRISCOKID
Well Randy since you give me assursances that it was not totally uncommon to run "tender first" then I guess that I won't build in a wye or turntable until hard evidence shows up.In case you're wondering,I'm building a layout of this prototype but being one of the smart readers of this board you were probably aware of this or something of this nature Gracias, Gene
Gene .. the Yreka Western RR is a shortline with about 8 miles of track between the towns of Yreka and Montague, California. I am an engineer there during the summers operating a 1915 Baldwin 2-8-2 light Mike over the system. We have no place to turn the train around so we just run around it and pull it back to Yreka, tender first. It *is* an operation that must be done with great caution ... especially when the fuel and water is low and reduces the weight of the tender. So far, over 12 years we have not had a problem. But we keep our speed at or below 10 mph.
Fitz ... no, not this time. McCloud bought back #18 last year when Kyle RR sold their holdings and have been in restoration ever since. I stopped by there about 10 days ago to see how they were coming with it. They were installing the air tanks and all the lagging. If it passed FRA inspection, it will doublehead with #25. We took #19 down there a couple of years ago to celebrate McCloud's 100th anniversary. Because #19 is equipped with friction bearings, UP will not allow it on their rails again. It's a pitty. I would love to see #18 and #19 doubled up once again. They have not done so since 1967 when #18 blew out a steam cylinder .. then sat unused until now!
Hey Bill,thanks for your personal experiance shared about running tender first.That might just add a whole new dimension to my layout! Mucho Gracias, Gene
Stepchild, I have a VCR tape that has a few seconds of two Big Boys running tender first pulling a string of cars up in Wyoming, so even the big Class A railroads did it when convenient.
<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Stepchld: Hey Bill,thanks for your personal experiance shared about running tender first.That might just add a whole new dimension to my layout! Mucho Gracias, Gene<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> De nada Gene If you would be interested in viewing a pic of old #19, you can find it at: http://members.nbci.com/thumper.4 [ 13 February 2001: Message edited by: Ironhorseman ]
Bill, Thanks for the update on Northern CA steam ops. Wish I could get down there this weekend. From the Weather reports it sounds like there will be snow, and two steamers working hard going uphill in the winter sure creates some great plumes and stack talk. Gene, you might want to build ( and maybe hide) a loop track to expedite your turning around, even though it isn't historically accurate.
