SP/SSW "SP" on the nose

I've been a SP railfan for a long, long time now. Along the way I'd acquired the opinion that if the nose had only the unit number, then it would be a Cotton Belt engine. In taking a closer look recently, boy, is that ever wrong. So was there a date in time when all SP engines had SP on the nose. And was there a date in time when Cotton Belt engines all had SSW on their nose? Or any considerations in between.

 

Hey Rick,

I have noticed the same...I use to be able to tell the difference between the the two groups..SSW and SP..by their Noses...but sometime during the eighties...The SP pulled a fast one on us railfans...and stopped doing that...unfortunately don't know the reason why...

a SP locomotive...early eighties


now a Cotton Belt loco...early eighties


and finally...here is a SP loco...with the numbers on the nose...providing the paradox...=)



[ March 02, 2006, 01:26 PM: Message edited by: NSCALEMIKE ]

 

SP had definite policies for painting the engines. These policies were not followed by the SP shops at all times and were rarely followed by the Cotton Belt at any time. Richard Percy’s Espee Modeler’s Home Page gives a few of these anomalies:

http://espee.railfan.net/b-list.html

This is only a partial list. I am not sure when the official policy of nose letters and nose numbers changed.

My favorite example of all this is the SP requirement that all F units have ladders on the engineer’s side of the nose of the engines and SP ladders soon appeared. Cotton Belt decided that the ladders should be on the fireman’s side and put them on the side opposite to the SP engines. This complied with the SP edict in spirit even if not to the letter.

[ March 02, 2006, 03:13 PM: Message edited by: Flash Blackman ]

 

The sans-serif "SP" was adopted on hood units in late 1971; some of the first units to get them (initially a small 15" tall version, later standardized to 21") were SDP45s. It was pretty standard on all new and repainted Southern Pacific units from then on, although a few odd units, like some U33Cs, one or two SD45T-2s, GP20s, and so on got Roman-style SP's.

Cotton Belt units kept using the 5" numbers on their ends, until the arrival of the 1984-built "Super Geeps" (late production GP40-2s), SSW 7248-7273. These had sans-serif "SSW" lettering on the nose, and all subsequent new and rebuilt Cotton Belt units, namely the SD45T-2Rs, GP40M-2s, GP60s, and B40-8s, had Roman-style "SSW" nose lettering.

 

Like mentioned earlier, the SP on the nose of hood units was introduced in 1971 (PAs, E and F-units notwithstanding). None of the SD45s were delivered with the SP on the nose, so this one is a repaint done in one of SP's shops.

SSW 7793 was built in 1980, a few years before SP decided to adopt "SSW" nose lettering (that made its debut on those GP40-2s I mentioned previously). Ironically, after it(and a bunch of other SP/SSW B30-7s) was overhauled in the early 90s, it got Speed Lettered, complete with a sans-serif "SP" on the nose.

I'm guessing the shot was taken sometime in the 1982-1983 timeframe, judging by the clean looking SD45 7431 trailing (rebuilt in April 1982). The lead unit is either in the original paint (9109 was built in October 1969), or else repainted/touched up before the SP started getting applied in late 1971, which would explain why it doesn't have "SP" on the nose. There's also the remote chance it was repainted (or at least touched up) sometime after the nose SP started being applied, but for whatever reason, the shop that did the work didn't have the proper SP stencils (or didn't care), and just applied the old-fashioned numbers instead. After all, paint shops never make mistakes!

[ March 02, 2006, 03:57 PM: Message edited by: SP 8299 ]

 

Okay Flash, thanks for the info. Do you know what the difinitive paint policy was that was in effect for hood unit nose's for the "date that will live in infamy" (9/11/96)?

 

Better to defer to the official SP experts, but I would say the official policy would be the sans-sherif (gothic?) initials on the nose with the speed-lettering SP logo.

One thing is for sure, that would only be the official policy. In 1996, there would be engines with varying paint schemes all over the SP /SSW system because the paint shops just couldn’t paint all the engines at one time. This has always been the case with SP and with other railroads, too. It gives modelers a lot of license when a modeler decides to model a particular time or era.

 

Like Flash said, official policy by the time of the assimilation was for SP units (and Speed Letter repaints) to have the sans-serif, 21" tall "SP" on the nose. Switchers and slugs were not supposed to get them, but some KC-based MP15AC Speed Lettered units got them anyway. Also, a couple Speed Lettered GP40-2s got a non-standard italicized sans-serif "SP", apparently at the whim of the painters.

 

Attn SP829: you said "KC-based". Does that mean based in Kansas City?

 

Yes. For the most part, SP's MP15DCs and MP15ACs were assigned to the Texas Lines, with many working terminals in Texas (naturally), Kansas City (Armourdale Yard), and other terminals on the central and eastern parts of the system. IIRC there were also some assigned to yards in the Pacific Northwest, but oddly enough they were fairly rare in Southern California; switching around here was dominated by SP SW1500s. And speaking of SW1500s, they weren't supposed to have an "SP" on the nose either, but a few Speed-Lettered repaints out here got them anyway; they were painted onto the front radiator shutters, underneath the grill:

http://espee.railfan.net/nonindex/sw1500_photos/2464sl_sp-sw1500-jay_glenewinkel.jpg

Gotta love paint shop resourcefulness. Even though you couldn't see it when the shutters were open, it was a nice touch.

Attn SP829: you said "KC-based". Does that mean based in Kansas City? </font>[/QUOTE]

[ March 05, 2006, 11:58 AM: Message edited by: SP 8299 ]