Can anyone help me confirm the Army used Pacific 4-6-2's ? and maybe the years that they operated , especally if during WWII and if they were G1, G2, G3 class . Did the military take over the rails during the war/s in figuritive ways or literally? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I6BP6QAwU2Y&feature=relmfu Pretty good steam shots of our WWII heros bound to liberate the world. If anyone recognizes the engine etc , please post if you have time as maybe some of us nugs are still learning the differance between a bucket of steam and a pound of diesel... thanks Paul
I don't believe the Army "used" Pacific 4-6-2s, at least not in WWII. I believe they demanded priority and made arrangements with private railroads to pull their long distance trains within the United States, the railroads using whatever motive power worked best for the job. The film shows Southern Railway #635, a Southern Pacific "Daylight" GS-4 4-8-4 and a flatcar from Missouri Pacific subsidiary St. Louis, Brownsville and Mexico. Armed services had some of their own freight and passenger cars, and tracks and switch engines on some bases. Much like a customer albeit a favored customer given special priority. In overseas theaters of operations, the military owned railroad equipment and had their own crews. In World War One, the government took over railroads directly and ran them under the United States Railroad Administration. I believe it was decided for WWII that that was not as efficient as having the railroads themselves run the railroads. There are several good books on the subject.
Yes, the railroad moving the "MAIN" (Military Authorized Identification Number) trains over their tracks, put whatever they had that was capable on the head end, to move it and deliver it to the next railroad, if that was part the route. My mom was an Army nurse with an Army General Hospital group in training at Ft Sill, Oklahoma. Early in the war, the 44th General Hospital packed up and were put on a train one evening, not knowing where they were going. It was not until the next morning when they were heading up the Royal Gorge to Tennessee Pass did they know they were heading to the Pacific theater. They ended up at the Mole in Oakland where they were ferried across the bay to the Army Presidio where they boarded a troop ship bound for Australia.
Thanks Kenneth, I will look around for any source that may have a roster of the Army's motive power and rolling stock from WWI to 1950, if anyone knows of such a list please feel free to pm me or list it here . It makes sense that they would have freight versions ( mountain or mallet ) than a pacific style passenger engine . That SP GS-4 engine was designed for passenger service mostly, from '41 to '58, with them pulling freight in '57-58 . I am still looking to confirm the Army had pacifics as they were arguably the most exported design of the 20's and 30's with the only major diff being the drivers and super heaters, 60 inch for frt and 72' for pass, my guess is the Army's would have been fitted with 60" as they would have hauled mixed frt and pass... I think it is always better to have the trade run the trade and not the gov ( LOL ) . Anyways ... I hope the Army had at least one pacific as I got one from MT with US ARMY on the tender ... Thanks again ! Paul
The Army seemed to be partial to 2-8-0 Consolidations. Here is a web site with many photos of US Army Steam locomotives.
Where she might have crossed paths with my father, who was hospitalized at least once for certain that I know about.
Nice link Russell thanks for posting it , you know , I bet some one in Army procurment liked the stance of the 2-8-0 's , good pass service , almost too light weight for moderate to heavy frt use with out the trailing truck , but could do 60 mph all day long , proably had a larger fire box and made more steam ( wonder if they had super heaters ) with a mixed consist... gave new meaning to the term fast mail until the stream liners, (steam and diesel) took over.
A good book on U S railroad involvement in WWII is Anerica's Fighting Railroads; A World War II Pictorial History by Don DeNevi, published Missoura, Montana: Pictorial Histories Publishing Co., 1996. Army and other service motive power shown: p.16 US Army Quartermaster Corps Plymouth diesel switcher p.53 USA #6994, 2-8-0 QMCUSA #8341, 2-8-0 that served in both WWI and WWII QMCUSA #7532 0-6-0 p.54 US Navy Porter center-cab diesel switcher USA #7450 diesel switcher
Unfortunately , since the OWL would not allow pics of the US RR during the war, not many pics are of actual equipment exist, although there is a lot of info on US RR history and there are a few videos out there produced by the War Dept , most of those from the book are either before or after but still worth the paper back edition at $15.Just from your listing , it would seem that the military used 2-8-0's and not the 4-6-2's ... darn , though it does make sense . Anybody want to trade my brand new 4-6-2 USArmy Pacific for a 2-8-0 Consolidated ??? or maybe I can renumber it to my freelance RR ....and forget the Army ... I would be more intrested in before the start of WWII , say mid 30's as those would most likely have carried thru to the late 40's as advances in technology prevailed at breakneck speed after the war .. things started changing in a hurry . As literale saviour of Europe , America had to pump out enough industry to rebuild all of Eruope and the Medditerainian , not to mention rebuilding Japan, SE Asia as far east as India ...monumental task for sure , but one we as Americans were up to in a heart beat, or at least back then.
In the North American homeland, I would suspect most of the Army locomotives were used on military installations to switch cars around. No need for high speed passenger locomotives. However, overseas they operated a lot of long distance trains. One in particular was in Iran. They used those railroads to ship supplies overland from the Persian Gulf to the USSR. Because of the arid geography, steam locomotives, mostly British built 2-8-0s, were replaced by Alco RSD-1 diesels as the war went on.
Makes sense. just like today when the Gov contracts a private carrier to haul Gov or GI stuff , it goes on a commerical transport. Back then, we saw pics / videos of Army ( or painted olive drab ) coaches hauling troops and frt. Like the Hospt group when it went ,did it go on " public " rail coach or on military coach , understanding that in war time , or any time military traveled " en mass" it was presumed to be " Fed Gov ". which would make it a Fed crime to mess with it ... I have a feeling that some of those in the hobby industry that make the models we buy do not so much research what they are presenting and we don't care lol.... we buy what looks cool or looks like something we want to make believe was real .... thanks Russell for bring some down to earth explanations ! Paul
