Why DSLR???

Dan Crowley Nov 2, 2005

  1. Powersteamguy1790

    Powersteamguy1790 Permanently dispatched

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    Leo:

    II'm using Nikon equipment now....

    Stay cool and run steam.... [​IMG] :cool: :cool:
     
  2. Fotheringill

    Fotheringill TrainBoard Member

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    Leo-

    You are both knowledgeable and informative.
    I have to question one thing, though, and it is somewhat of a pet peeve of mine.
    "...which means at home you can take a digital image which is magazine (full page) quality...."

    I know next to nothing about cameras. I couldn't even load the film into a Nikon 6006. But, from what I have seen in the quality of pictures (not subject matter at all) but the quality of the photos in both N scale publications and MRR, I think that even I can take pictures that are at least as good with a Nikon D70s as what I have seen published. To me, it seems that there an exclusive few who get their pictures published in the three magazines and the shots are not all that hot.
     
  3. Leo Bicknell

    Leo Bicknell TrainBoard Member

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    There are two aspects to a magazine quality photo. The first is the composition. I've seen photos from some of the modelers on the web sites that absolutely put the magazines to shame in this aspect. A better framed a lit scene, sharply focused, with great detail in the scene.

    However, the second aspect you hit is actual technology. I'll do the worst case. If you want a two page spread in a magazine you're talking about a roughtly 16"x11" starting image (even if you crop out part for text/headlines). Most magazines print at 135dpi these days. That's a 2160x1485 image, or roughly 3MP. But wait, you've probably cropped the image overall, or centered it, or otherwise had to move it to make the text work. Figuring a 25% loss for that, you need to start with a 4MP image. But, here's the real kicker, due to the color management involved in printing you either need 3x or 4x oversamping, so you're in the 12-16MP range.

    This is backed up by MR's guidelines, http://www.trains.com/Content/Dynamic/Articles/000/000/003/103ohnbr.asp, "large photos need 10MP or better". Notice smaller is ok for smaller photos that won't be in a whole spread, but they still want 5MP for a "trackside" photo.

    So, if you're looking to submit images that could end up as full page spreads, right now a Canon 5D is probably the absolute low end of what would work (12MP), and a Canon 1DMkII would be preferred (16MP). Unfortunately those are $3k and $8k cameras right now.

    If you're submitting photos documenting your work, or smaller trackside photos a Digital Rebel (6MP) or Rebel XT (8MP) are probably ok.
     
  4. Fotheringill

    Fotheringill TrainBoard Member

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    Leo-

    I now have a better understanding. Thank you.
     
  5. Leo Bicknell

    Leo Bicknell TrainBoard Member

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    A fine choice. In that case there's always e-bay...there's still a market for those FD's, and you might get enough to buy anothe Nikkor lense. [​IMG]
     
  6. Powersteamguy1790

    Powersteamguy1790 Permanently dispatched

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    Mark:

    I just bought a Nikon D-50; the D-70's smaller counterpart. It came with an 18:55mm lens. I also ordered a micro Nikkor 60 mm F 2.8 1:1 macro lens which I'll pick up after I return from Dallas at the end of the month.

    Nikon has done a wonderful job with their DSLR's. I'll be taking a few photo's with the camera before I leave for Dallas on Tuesday.

    I hope you had a wonderful trip to Ireland. Speak to you when I get back.. [​IMG]

    Stay cool and run steam... [​IMG] :cool: :cool:
     
  7. Pete Nolan

    Pete Nolan TrainBoard Supporter

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    This is a great thread--I've relearned some stuff that had migrated away due to other stuff occupying my gray cells.

    Color management and oversampling are issues that most of us don't understand very well, especially in the digital realm. The digital camera to analog press issues bewilder me, even after 40 years working with printers. I do understand digital camera to digital press issues, but that applies only to limited press runs. All of the higher circulation magazines are printed with traditional presses, an analog process with plates and inks.

    Perhaps someone could expand upon the digital to analog process a bit more? I can explain the digital-to-digital process, but I've fallen far behind the curve on digital-to-conventional press process.

    In other words, what happens to your digital image once a magazine accepts it? What happens to the image your camera takes? What do art directors do to it? What happens next?

    As I said, I've been out of this area of production for so long that I just don't know what happens any more.
     
  8. Leo Bicknell

    Leo Bicknell TrainBoard Member

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    Pete: I don't have a clue on how it works. I vaguely know they make CMYK or RGB (or perhaps more colors) plates for the printing. My personal theory is that to get even tones they do a dithering sort of process where the single pixel that is printed is adjusted based on the 4-8 surrounding pixels, so they need more pixels to make it right.
     
  9. Powersteamguy1790

    Powersteamguy1790 Permanently dispatched

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    A fine choice. In that case there's always e-bay...there's still a market for those FD's, and you might get enough to buy anothe Nikkor lense. [​IMG] </font>[/QUOTE]Just picked up a Nikkor 2.8 60 mm 1:1 macro lens for closeup photography for my new Nikon D-50.

    I should have it sometime in the first week of December.

    This will complement the Nikkor 18:55mm lens that came with the camera.


    Stay cool and run steam...... [​IMG] :cool: :cool:
     
  10. fitz

    fitz TrainBoard Member

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    My wife and I went to the discount stores nearby, and they have a camera shop. I stopped in and had a Nikon D50 in my hands. They wanted $779. I had to put it down and rapidly exit the store or I would have bought it. :(
     
  11. Powersteamguy1790

    Powersteamguy1790 Permanently dispatched

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    Fitz:

    The Nikon D-50 is a great value. Some online e-tailers have the D-50 for $699.


    Stay cool and run steam...... [​IMG] :cool: :cool:
     
  12. Leo Bicknell

    Leo Bicknell TrainBoard Member

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    The D50 is a great camera. If you're looking for cheap, look for a lightly used one on E-Bay, or a Canon 300D (the 6.0 MP Digital Rebel, Eg the First One). Many people have upgraded to a D70 or 350D, and are selling lightly used ones for half the original price.
     
  13. Pete Nolan

    Pete Nolan TrainBoard Supporter

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    There's a reason to buy digital SLRs locally and pay perhaps $100 extra: they do break occasionally. And when they break, it's usually a six-week repair process with Nikon. I had a flash tube in a D100 blow out under warranty: six weeks. My local store gave me a loaner, which saved two assignments.

    The imagers in DSLRs also get dirty over time. It's nice to have a local shop that knows you and gives you good service--like four hours--for a cleaning. Yes, it's $80 a camera, but I prefer not to try it myself. If you're changing lenses a lot, the imager will need a cleaning once a year. I have two cameras now (one is officially the back-up), so I'm not switching lenses as much. But I'll still have them checked out and cleaned once a year.
     
  14. Fotheringill

    Fotheringill TrainBoard Member

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    Being a huge fan of instant gratification, I am quite happy with my purchase of the Nikon D70s. I will be awaiting Bob's report on the macro lens with great interest.
     
  15. Pete Nolan

    Pete Nolan TrainBoard Supporter

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    Me too!

    In the meanwhile, I'm preparing an article on why quality pixels are important for publication. It's stuff I learned in the early 1980s, wiped out of my memory, and am trying to resurrect.
     
  16. MK

    MK TrainBoard Member

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    Pete, it's pretty easy to clean the sensor yourself. First try is with a Giottos Rocket blower. Usually that gets the job done. If not, PEC pads with Eclipse cleaning fluid.

    The first time is always a heart rate raiser but after that it's a no brainer. Although the sensor is delicate, it's not as delicate as you think.
     
  17. Pete Nolan

    Pete Nolan TrainBoard Supporter

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    So I've been told. I think I've just had too many heart rate raisers in my life. It's a business expense. If I was out in the field and it happened, I'd do it in a heartbeat--I've got the blower in my bag. But this guy checks out everything. He's an old coot, and I love talking with him about old Leicas and Nikons.
     
  18. Glenn Woodle

    Glenn Woodle TrainBoard Member

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    About the process of converting photos for printing use. I used to work for RR Donnelley, the big magazine printer.

    Printing inks are a lot different than paint or color screens. It's a different chemistry. A lot depends on what process is used, & the press run. In the old days, a set of 8 plates would be made for each "page". Basically, printing makes 4 plates: Black, Yellow, Blue, Red. Some colors require a special ink like metallic for a certain effect. Press speeds put the ink & dry it on both sides of the "page". Then the signature gets folded to be the mag page you see.

    Today computers handle all stages of the process, to get it "right". The same process occurs for your newspaper inserts. So MR may require a print to be done in a certain format for it's program to operate properly. These programs are not cheap.

    Another variable is the type of paper MR or other publications use. Recycled papers used to have a grayish part to them. Depends on the whiteness & the weight of the paper, with heavier paper going on the cover pages.
     
  19. Powersteamguy1790

    Powersteamguy1790 Permanently dispatched

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    Mark:

    I'm anxiously awaiting the arrival of the Nikkor 60 mm f2.8 1:1 macro lens. It was shipped this morning from B&H Photo in New York and I should receive it by the end of the week. I'll be back in Florida late Tuesday November 29th.

    I've only taken about 30 photo's with the new Nikon D-50. I'm looking forward to testing the camera out with the 1:1 macro lens.

    So far, I very pleased with the D-50 which I bought locally for the reasons Pete mentioned in his above post.

    It's a pleasure to take photo's with an F28-36 DOF instead of the DOF of 8-13.4 that I could only acheive with the Nikon Coolpix 4300. [​IMG]

    Stay cool and run steam...... [​IMG] :cool: :cool:
     
  20. MK

    MK TrainBoard Member

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    Bob, don't confuse DOF of a DSLR with the DOF of a P&S. By the very nature of their lens design (very very short absolute focal length), point and shoot digicams have tremendous DOF even at large f-stops. You'll get different DOF with f8 in a DSLR and a f8 in a P&S.

    You'll find that you need f22 in a DSLR to achieve what can be done with f8 in a P&S, as an example. When I switched to my D70, I loved the shallow DOF for portraiture but hated it for things like layout photography. Sometimes I fire up my oldie Coolpix 950 for that. [​IMG]
     

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