What's with the Athearn dummy units? They roll terribly!!!! No matter what I do the wheels will not roll correctly!! I have tried to make sure they are correctly spaced and up to NMRA standards. I put two on the track behind my Kato Dash 9 and the thing can barely move them with 15 well cars in tow!!! That is not how that should be working. Anyone have any suggestions. Is there an option as far as replacing the trucks to something other than Athearn's?? If so, I am interested (Walthers pages would be helpful). As always---thanks in advance!
<font color="336633">Best thing is to replace the wheels with NWSL ones, ill get some cat numbers for you tomorrow as my walthers cat is locked up in my workshop, unless someone else does it b4 me </font>
The wheel replacement should help, but the main issue with Athearn dummies is weight, they weigh almost as much as a powered loco so will take the place of several freight cars. When we're putting together consists on Rock Springs we try & ensure that we have a minimum of two powered loco's in every consist (20+ cars) as we found the same as you, that adding a dummy does detract from the train performance. Adding two is obviously worse! The only things we can send out with one powered unit are Proto SD60's, they can seriously pull, but then they won't easily MU with anything else either so it's a good thing they'll handle a dummy!!! One slightly odd thing we've done is "powered dummies", where to MU Athearn to Atas/Kato we have just pulled the drive shafts & worms out, the metal wheeled "powered" trucks from Athearn freewheel much better than the dummies, and you can always convert it back to a powered machine if you need it
I tell ya guys, I have a few dummies too and I found something interesting on Athearn. If you have the new Athearn dummies they are all but worthless... Speaking in a past venture with them as BNSF has.... BUT the older Athearn dummies roll a terrible lot better then the new ones! Why Is the fact of the trucks the ole trucks snaped onto the frame with 2 little pin type mounting lugs that swiveled freely and was not tight on holding the wheels (kinda like the rolling stock trucks but bigger) And they run fine with any and all of my powered loco's. Its the way the newer versions are made with the powered type trucks side frames and interior frame structures.. they hold onto the wheels tighter..... Where the old ones have the pin point on the axles and thats what holds the wheels in the truck and so on... The newer Athearn dummies I won't buy because of their not-so-easy-rolling-feature And if so I try to replace the new trucks with the older generation trucks and wheels... [ 11 October 2001: Message edited by: 7600EM_1 ]</p>
Well I tore the whole thing apart(athearn powered C44) and checked the gears for flash and made sure that they interacted correctly with the drive wheels without noise. I then re-assembled the thing only to find out that the noise had not gone away---very loud still. So, I took out the worm gears and the drive shafts and things were really quite with the motor running. I don't know how to do anything about that problem so I took your advice and made it a powered dummy! Man does that thing roll nicely. Good weight and smooth to boot. THanks for the advice---I just wish that I could have found a way to make the drive line quite so I could have a powered unit. If anyone has any good suggestions I would sure like to know. By the way. EM7600 was that 2-8-8-2 that you just got an AHM or a Riv? And if you have too many would you consider parting with it? Thanks again.
BNSF, You can call me John is easier to remmeber but anyway.... The 2-8-8-2 is a AHM, old Rivarossi. I plan to make it yet another EL class B&O. Never can have to many articulateds! I do alot of double heading my articulateds and all so.. It will end up a 2-8-8-0 B&O EL class of some sort.... I got the Rivarossi's newest version EL-5 B&O #7165, ex. Y6b, AHM/Rivarossi EL-6 B&O #7307, ex. Y6b, AHM/Rivarossi EL-5 7160, and another AHM/Rivarossi ex Y6b made into a EL-5 #7145, and now the one I just got! Plus 4 ex UP Big Boys that were customized into B&O EM-1's #'s 7600, 7601, 7614, 7615..... I love my articulated steamers... Sorry but I can't part part with the latest one! It'll end up a EL-6 I believe. The B&O got a few 2-8-8-2's from Seaboard in 1947, and made them 2-8-8-0's instead of 2-8-8-2's.... They were class EE-2 when received from Seaboard and then made into 2-8-8-0's class EL-6's. Some guys on the B&O forum in Borhs.org say that the B&O did run them awhile as 2-8-8-2's and then some other guys say they never ran them as 2-8-8-2's and changed them imediately when gotten to 2-8-8-0's so.. I modeled one already as a 2-8-8-2 EL-6 #7307 and this new one will be a EL-6 with the trailing truck amputated as a 2-8-8-0.. Just for the roster..... I'll soon have 15 articulateds as my motive power management supervisor tells me! [ 31 October 2001: Message edited by: 7600EM_1 ]</p>
John is a man after my own heart! The only articulated I lack now, is a 2-10-10-2 and an AC-9 2-8-8-4 I may have to build from scratch if I live that long.
Watash, I have four Big Boys (now customized Yellowstones), one Big Boy untouched by my hands, two Challengers, one factory 2-8-8-0, four 2-8-8-2's, one Allegheny, one Cab Forwards (just gotten), And one half built and half disassembled 2-6-6-2 Mantua. ALL are Rivarossi Yellowstones (ex. Big Boys), Challengers, Cab Forwards, and 2-8-8-2's and 2-8-8-0! The Allegheny is Arbour, and the 2-6-6-2 is Mantua. Those are just my articulated steamers! I also have two 2-10-2 "big Sixes", seven 2-8-2's, eight 4-6-2's, two 4-8-2's, three 2-8-4's, one 2-10-0, and countless 2-8-0's, 0-8-0's, and 0-6-0's, and 0-4-0's..... Most of them have the good ole Rivarossi stamped in them somewhere!! HE HE A few are Mantua, and Bachmann... The Mantua's run like scared jack rabbits but no where near like the Rivs do! My Bachmann's should be like the TYCO ones I have and DUMMIES! They don't run worth !@#$ Sorry guys recount I have 15 articulateds! I'll soon have 20! I didn't realize I had so many off the top of my head I had to go look at my file! Almost 15 didn't seem right for some reason! Because I left a few out and didn't count them. I have 15 so far! So... I have alot more of the collection I bought to go through I may find more to add to my collection! Snicker, snicker He He [ 31 October 2001: Message edited by: 7600EM_1 ]</p>
You are a Polutacrat John! Keep in mind I have a nice warm roundhouse to keep any of your orphaned articulateds in if you run out of room! My roundhouse has stalls that can be easily extended to house another Mallet! Have you ever run four on the front, two in the middle, and three in the rear handeling around 180 cars, like at a club? I have always wanted to get a video of that!
Watash, I've ran four EM-1's on the point in consecutive order, three EL-5 in the middle and two challengers on the rear keeping up the slack on 200 to 225 cars! And they all hauled WELL. I ran them on 3 MRC dual packs inline wired! I did that demonstartion on a bet......The guys told me my track laying skills and loco control skills and coupler applications wasn't good enough.... I told 'em to put their money where their mouth was! Guess who walked out with a $150 bet plus asked for double or nothing to make it interesting and all plus I know my loco's, car's and skills so well I left the whole shabang run 3 hours! The local rival Model Railroader club's layout.... a 40' by 60' and they told me it couldn't be done! I just laughed and held out my hand! I believe I made a few mad! HE HE Anyway the guys were spellbound and all with the ones I knew pretty good and all... The ones that were SOB's were mad and and had a few choice words with me after I took their money! But a day latter I joined a way better club thats dirrectly across the street from me so.... But still the layout I run their is bearly big enough to run 50 to 60 cars but I have and all so... Mike K (6206_S1a) was also with me on the 50 to 60 car run... One loco on the point and one in the middle and one on the rear keeping up the slack, and a few guys couldn't then believe their eyes! So I did a few things alot of guy never thought was possible! Its all in fun now.. I don't bet no more. I'm tired of litterally taking guys money its gotten old... HE HE HE [ 31 October 2001: Message edited by: 7600EM_1 ]</p>
I lack a 2-6-6-4, 2-6-6-0, and 0-6-6-0! I want to model a B&O KB-1 I believe thats the class of the B&O 2-6-6-4's or it may be KK-1. I can't remember off hand one is a 2-6-6-2 and the other is a 2-6-6-4. And my 0-6-6-0 Watash you know what he'll be.. "Old Maude" sound familar? I want the first articulated steamer in America.. and one day i'll get an itch and the place dreams begin will be putting two 0-6-0's together to make one! And another loco I want to get is the brute 0-10-0 B&O. The largest non articulated steam switcher in America! One of these fine days!!!! [ 31 October 2001: Message edited by: 7600EM_1 ]</p>
Here's what I do to quiet down an Athearn locomotive.... After I do this they run pretty good, and quiet to boot! First, open it up and remove the trucks. Fill the gears with pearl drops tooth polish. Put it back together and run it for about a half hour. This should break in the delrin gears in the trucks. Not take it all apart again and completely clean the trucks. You'll get all sorts of crud out of the trucks, as well as any potential for over or under-lubrication from the factory. Now put the trucks together and lube them up with a light grease. You can also clean the trucks out by just blasting them with the garden hose so you don't have to take them apart...... On the motor, pull out the brushes and go over the armature with a very narrow strip of 600 grit wet-dry while gently turning the motor by hand. Finish the armature off by rubbing it with a pencil eraser. Now take a very tiny paint brush and lightly lubricate the motor bearings with WD-40 or other very light oil. Don't get any oil near the armature. Put the brushes back in and the motor is now done. Now for the worm gears.... Go over them with some 600 grit wet-dry to take the sharp edges off of them. Glue one end of the each of the drive-lines into the worm-gear end. Both ends of the drivelines slip, but you only need one end to do it. Now put slightly lube up the other end of the driveline with a heavy grease so that it'll take up a little slack in the motor end. Put the trucks back into the locomotive. When you install the worm gears into the trucks, check for any play in them. You'll probably need to shim them, as a lot of them are loose. This is a source of noise. Try and find some very thin teflon or mylar shim washers. In a pinch a Kadee shim washer can be used, but they're not that smooth. Be careful not to shim the gear too tight, or it'll run slowly..... Well-lubricate the worm gear as you install it, and snap down the retainer on the truck. The drive-train is now completed. Give it a good test-run o check it all out. I usually add a bunch of lead in the locomotive to increase the tractive force the little guy can put out. Inside the body along the roof is a good spot to put it. I usually add about 6 ounces or until I run out of room. A GP-60 is a little tight... I've added up to 9 or 10 ounces in an AC4400, but could have added more (I might still do it!). As long as you can still spin the wheels at full throttle you'll be O.K. Getting a larger diesel up to 1 1/2 or 2 pounds is the goal. The standard Athearn diesels are not as quiet as their cousins, the Genesis Steamers, but they're a good value for the money, and with good hours on them to break them in good they're a good addition to anyone's set. Being the tight-wad that I am, I've only been buying Athearn's lately. My Athearns are now running as well as my Stewart PA-7. Mark.
Here's another solution to the dummy unit problem.... Run only powered units! After all, is it possible to have too many locomotives running on your track? Mark
Mark: Thanks for the information on the noise reduction! I have checked the gears for flash and noise and have checked the worms for play. On both areas the engine has none of the usual problems. I will have to look more closely at the worms for flash though. However, most of my inspections revealed that most of the noise comes from the drive shafts. Seems like the u-joints aren't working real well and allow the drive shafts to make a bunch of noise. Since I have never taken one of these apart before I am having to learn from you all as to what the tricks are. I will say that after taking it all apart and cleaning it the thing runs stronger and faster, but dang it sounds like a chainsaw. Thanks for the help.
Here's a couple questions for 7600EM_1: 1. What coupler arrangement did you use in your EL-5 pilots? 2. Did you have to do any special detailing to make the Y6's into EL-5's? 3. What changes did you make to convert a Big Boy into a EM-1? Thanks! jdcheng
JD, The pilot coupler's on my EL-5's are Kadee #4's shimed, the shims are put ontop of the coupler itself and then centered for the pin that originally held the dummy knuckle in place I used it to hold the Kadee and then from the bottom and behind the pilot I inserted the coupler spring... On turning my Y6b's 2-8-8-2's into B&O EL-5's, I did the following: replaced the front pilot truck, the Y6b has the outside bearing with a frame like a roller bearing trailing truck, I put an inside bearing pilot truck without a frame for a roller bearing, I however removed the rear trailing truck being the N&W Y6b is a 2-8-8-2 and the B&O EL-5 is a 2-8-8-0. In the overall body (boiler casting I removed the bell from the spot near the cab to the front of the boiler, (either on the side mounting possition, or mounted it like the EM-1's were right in the dead center of the boiler at the top in front of the preheater(i believe thats what that cast on detail is anyway), anyway right in front of the single stack in front of the square box where the bolt is to hold the boiler casting onto the main frame below. I also replaced the N&W welded square tender with a Rivarossi Vanderbuilt tender. I also remove the number plate on the smoke box door and replace it with a B&O capol dome emblem plate.... Then the whole thing gets a paint job!!!! The EM-1's, I done everything that I could do so far with time and money to redesign it.... I still have a few details to redesign though. I retooled the pilot deck, the front pilot truck from a 4- to a 2- and cut up the front of the boiler to redesign it to a flat fronted with smoke box from the orginal UP design to what the B&O's EM-1's were, replaced the tender with a Y6b square welded tender, then gave it an overall paint job. I still have to retool my domes on the boiler and the diameter of the wheels. The Wheel are factory scale 69 inch that the UP Big Boys had and the B&O's EM-1 wheels should be 64 inch diameter (driver wheels). I'll post a few pictures of each that i've done.... So you can have a look for yourself...
By the way, I forgot to mention I specialize in custom orders for B&O steamers.. If interested in anything or questions e-mail me at: yellowstone10@hotmail.com By my e-mail address you can tell what my favorite loco is... The B&O EM-1 which was a "Yellowstone"
JD, Heres a picture of my EM-1. Which was a Rivarossi Big Boy.... Now a Yellowstone! I don't have any pictures of my ex Y6b's online yet.. That are now EL-5's But I will... [ 07 November 2001: Message edited by: 7600EM_1 ]</p>
John. who did you get the air pumps from to put on the Yellowstone smoke box? Were they nearly $4.00 each retail?
