Is it just me, or have rolling stock prices just jumped.....

DCESharkman Feb 20, 2016

  1. BarstowRick

    BarstowRick TrainBoard Supporter

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    Dollar short and day late and yes you aren't alone. Everything and I don't care what scale you operate in is going up in price. Why? I don't know but having things manufactured in China isn't saving me any monies. They've priced me right out of the market. Glad I have what I have and that I purchased most of it five or six years ago. That's how quickly things have changed.

    If you are in the same shape as I then it's time to declare a Moratorium on buying. Are you with me?
     
    Last edited: Feb 21, 2016
  2. jpwisc

    jpwisc TrainBoard Member

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    You are right on. These are businesses and they know their business. They know what their price points are. Again, I welcome anyone who think they are overcharging to try to make a quality product for less. I don't think you could do it.

    A lot of people are armchair businessmen. Of course we all want things for less money. This hobby costs money, plain and simple. Manufacturers are not in the charity business. They have costs they need to cover and profit they need to achieve. Business 101.

    Milk cost more than it did in the 80's, houses cost more and cars cost more. Why would model trains be any different? I get so tired of the "Back in the day" speeches. Time moves forward and things change. Get used to it, because more change is coming faster, forever.
     
  3. mtntrainman

    mtntrainman TrainBoard Supporter

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    And when manufactures close their doors or are bought out by other manufactures...some just wanna lay down and cry ! Bussiness as usual 101 !!!
     
  4. BoxcabE50

    BoxcabE50 HOn30 & N Scales Staff Member TrainBoard Supporter

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    Yes. Change is always coming. Not only for consumers, but also businesses. There is no way of knowing how it will all shake out, for better or for worse, until it happens. Not just one, but both must adjust to the market. The opposite of businesses not making ends meet, can be possibly pricing themselves out of a market. Especially in this segment, where their goods are way, way down the list of life sustaining necessity.
     
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  5. Inkaneer

    Inkaneer TrainBoard Member

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    I think people are reasonable enough to know that prices go up for many reasons. But I think they also know that they have limits as to what they can commit their discretionary income to. Back in the day one could run a fifty car train on an Ntrak layout for $150-$200. Today that unit train will be over $2,000. Wages have not kept pace with prices. The economy is not equitable to all.

    I still believe that all this is related, in a large part, to the China situation. A lot of business people got duped into thinking they could lower their costs and found out there was a price to be paid for it all. So the cost is passed on and now the end buyer is paying that price.
     
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  6. mtntrainman

    mtntrainman TrainBoard Supporter

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    OR...the smart consumer ISNT paying the prices...and the manufactures are or will be suffering. JMO
     
  7. acptulsa

    acptulsa TrainBoard Member

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    That's what we get for not demanding sound money. They can shrink the value of the dollar like wool in a hot dryer, and there's no way we can ask for raises often enough to keep up.
     
  8. Point353

    Point353 TrainBoard Member

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    Then the low cost subcontract manufacturer kicked out most of its customers.
    If you couldn't retrieve your tooling, or it somehow got "damaged", or it wasn't compatible with the machinery at the new
    subcontract manufacturer, then you had to start over from scratch.
     
  9. Mike C

    Mike C TrainBoard Member

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    I like the well detailed cars . But I don't have to buy them unless I want . I spent an average of 30 bucks on 4 different cars a week ago just because I'd seen that they had come out . Rapido reefers and BLW Nyc 40" boxes . I look at this as a hobby , and it's going to cost money . But I also have to be semi responsible . Needs come first hobby second . Everythings going up and I doubt that it will stop . Being on a limited budget doesen't help , and neither does my other hobby , salt water Reef tank , but I save for what I want and buy with cash . I just think we are going to have to get used to higher prices and maybe not build that basement filling monster that we want , but settle for something smaller and more manageable .
     
  10. DCESharkman

    DCESharkman TrainBoard Member

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    As the owner of a manufacturing business, I have warned time and time again about the the China economic model, go low first and soak later. Still everyone wants to run offshore. I still beat Chinese competitors every time and still make a nice profit.

    I have more than enough cash flow to buy whatever, I just was shocked after not buying any new cars or locomotives for over a year what the prices became. Just because I can afford it, doesn't mean I will purchase it. There has to be a sensibility to it.

    I drive a 20 year old car because it suits me. I run 20 year old locomotives and rolling stock because they suit me. I am not pining for lower prices, just posting an observation.

    As I said, I was constrained by a parental budget for my nephew, not by my finances.

    But it seems that I can not justify some of the prices I am seeing either. So my money goes more for ice cream than trains these days. And the best thing ever, a hot fudge sundae while running trains!
     
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  11. jpwisc

    jpwisc TrainBoard Member

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    I agree whole heartedly.
     
  12. Inkaneer

    Inkaneer TrainBoard Member

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    WHAT???? That is heresy. A sacrilege I tell you (as he rends his garment).
     
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  13. Calzephyr

    Calzephyr TrainBoard Supporter

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    Hmmm... and I was considering a warehouse sized N scale layout... count me in on the blasphemous garment rending tirade.... lol

    Sent from my SM-G530T using Tapatalk
     
    Last edited: Feb 22, 2016
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  14. Calzephyr

    Calzephyr TrainBoard Supporter

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    It's a real-world economic China Syndrome. A financial contagion that suckered our populous into believing that foreign country really had our best interest in mind by providing low priced items of all types... even model trains. It looked great at first... but now we pay the piper.


    Sent from my SM-G530T using Tapatalk
     
    Last edited: Feb 22, 2016
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  15. Arctic Train

    Arctic Train TrainBoard Member

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    I echo the fact that model railroading is a discretionary expendature. Unlike staples such as milk and gasoline ( unless your lactose intolerant or drive an electric car). I understand the fact the costs of manufacturing are constantly on the rise, however I believe we are at or rapidly approaching a tipping point to where people (me) simply can't justify the cost of a good quality boxcar. It's a tough nut for manufacturers, raise msrp to cover production costs and then suffer the colapse of your sales numbers due to "unreasonable" prices (as percieved by the consumer), or cut costs sell a million units and go broke.

    I can see in the near future with the development of 3D printers we as a group will begin to morph more toward becoming custom modelers and drift away from ready made products due to the imbalance of prices vs discretionary funds.

    Brian
     
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  16. mtntrainman

    mtntrainman TrainBoard Supporter

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    Personally...I believe we are already at that tipping point...and have been for a long while...JMO
     
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  17. BoxcabE50

    BoxcabE50 HOn30 & N Scales Staff Member TrainBoard Supporter

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    In previous similar discussions, I have suggested this very same possibility. 3D has gained a lot of traction. I know the HOn30 fraternity has really grabbed hold of this, and are getting many desired items already via 3D.
     
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  18. Calzephyr

    Calzephyr TrainBoard Supporter

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    I have to agree with you on the 'already at the tipping point' comment.
    I used to buy a lot more rolling stock in the early 2000's. When a run of Atlas wood reefers or 11,000 gallon tanks cars were announced I often bought every one of the models in both numbers. The last few times they ran the wood reefers... I have become more selective and buy only one number of a few models in the run. I have cut down on most Micro-trains purchases as well. I am far more selective on the models being very close to... and prefer actual replicas of the prototypes. I am buying less... but... the cost is higher on the fewer items I do get.

    What I call the 'Legacy' models of 25 to 50 years ago are ones that I have found to be non-prototypical for the roads they are printed for; which was a common practice back in the 1960's to 1990's (and still happening today). Things began changing in the 1990's... and prices began to increase as well. I really prefer 'replicas' of the prototype instead of... stand-ins. I am willing to pay more for the fidelity to the prototype... and have done so over the past 10 years. However, as mentioned on several occasions... the 'Legacy' tooling has changed very little in the past 50 years... and the prices have increased dramatically.

    While others will not pay $30 for a replica piece of rolling stock... with all the little bells and whistles attached... I do appreciate the effort to create them so I don't have to 'hack one up' and do my best rendition of a Picasso paint job. Believe me... I'm not the "modeler" in model railroading. Bear in mind that I would love for them to be $10 bucks or less... but... I am also a realist. So instead of buying 10 different road names... I'll buy 4... and hope to acquire the others numbers as they become available on eBay or a swap meet.
     
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  19. Calzephyr

    Calzephyr TrainBoard Supporter

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    YES... 3D will become more of this hobby going forward; however, It isn't going to be a cheaper alternative than the present injection molded products.
    I like it for the ability to create actual prototype models... but... it will cost more than we presently are spending. Just the plain... unpainted kits are waaayyyy up in price. Imagine the assembly and painting and decal/pad printing costs added to that! I would expect prototype rolling stock and locomotive to be much more expensive than they are right now.
     
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  20. JMaurer1

    JMaurer1 TrainBoard Member

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    Sharkman: I happen to like your 20YO car and I also think you are right.

    I WON'T pay $30 for a piece of rolling stock unless it is something I just can't live without (and there are very few that I can't live without). Taking a quick look, I can find Atlas 40'DD boxcars, the SAME boxcar that they have been selling forever, listed at $13 for older runs and $20 for the latest run. I sure don't understand why. The molds are payed for and the printing doesn't cost THAT much more. In fact (at one website) the new $20 (list) car is painted in one color and printed in another color (white lettering) and an older $13 car has two printed colors but is cheaper. Same holds true for 40'PD boxcars: $18 (list) for newest run, $12 for older. No matter how much I would like to have a new Atlas WP PS-1 boxcar, I'm not getting any for $29 each ($20.25 on line price). I've paid less than that for locomotives in the past. Love the car, but won't pay the price. BTW, it's not just Atlas (they were just the easiest to find old and new examples of), it's the industry.

    I agree, we are passing the tipping point...it's just taking some time for the scale to swing to the other side. The only thing keeping this going is the limited runs. I don't think we will ever see a quality MFR producing a line of cars that aren't limited run ever again. Granted, the older hobbyists are getting older and either dying or leaving the hobby, but there isn't the influx of new younger hobbyists entering to replace them...trains aren't 'cool' compared to gaming systems and the internet. The hobby isn't doing well, but the prices are probably going to finish it off. Unfortunately, I don't see any way to stop or change the direction this is heading...
     

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