What is it that your heart really wants with this layout? You've said point-to-point switching layout but it sounds like you enjoy modern mainline action and would get enjoyment from just railfanning (ie: watching your trains rolling through nice scenery). Here's a solution I suggest: Make a dogbone layout with turn-around at each end and hidden staging behind the layout but use scenery to hide the loop ends thus making your layout appear as a scene along a larger mainline. The is my concept idea for the opposite ends of your layout, made out of Kato Unitrack using the program AnyRail: The grid scale on that graphic is 12", so you can can see you will lose about 1 1/2' on each end, or 3' total from the entire layout, which still gives you 7' of "viewable" layout. That's quite a decent length. About the turnaround design: Running any sort Amtrack or mainline freight on a 10' Point-to-point is just rather silly. Even with massive amounts of staging the train will only be "on stage" for a few minutes and that's if it's really creeping along. Making a dog-bone style layout can give you the look of a double track mainline. Since you are talking the North East, even with modern CtC, the high traffic volume still demands multiple track mains (especially along the North East Corridor!). I don't think a 1 track "mainline" gives the feel of modern railroading. For the main viewable parts of the layout I'd use #6 turnout, but "offstage" #4s will work and save you space. The turnout at the top of the loop in my photo is a #4 and can lead to a multitrack double ended staging yard that stretches the entire length of the layout along the backside and is hidden by a backdrop. 5'+ staging yards at each of the layout would be great for a room or basement spanning empire but for a 10' shelf when that's all the space you have I think it's unrealistic. Even including staging would be difficult, and you see the best idea I came up with above. Originally I though of placing the staging under the layout, which I suppose you could still try if you wanted to run the hidden staging track down to a lower level. The main problem you are encountering here isn't actually space: it's your necessary minimum radius. Minimum radius difficulties: Modern diesel locomotives, freight cars and passenger equipment are long and look horrible on tight radius, and that's if it can even make the turn to begin with. You need to use the maximum radius you can. For a 24" deep layout with Unitrack, that means an 11" radius. Now that still won't look great but you know what: we don't care! The curves are "offstage" we just need them to be long enough so your 6 axle road diesels and Am-fleet cars stay on the track. General design ideas: Your examples include scenery of country side yet also you want an engine facility, some industries and a small yard which are all more commonly found in built up areas. I suggest you start one side of your layout "in the country" and progressively make it more urban, thus giving them impression that you are on the outskirts approaching a city. Hide the "country" side curve going under an overpass. On the city side the tracks can disappear under a building! There's plenty example of buildings built over the tracks (or tracks running under the cityscape). You can add a small commuter station along the tracks nearest the viewer side, opposite the "switching" side, which will also make use of the space between tracks and the layout edge. Don't run the track exactly parallel along the layout edge the entire length. I'd suggest putting a very slight curve in it. That greatly enhances the visual appeal of the layout. The slight curve combined with scenery between the veiwer and trains will really enhance the look of your layout! As the tracks draw nearer the city side you can have a small engine servicing and/or refueling facility. Perhaps the railroad just doesn't have full service shops here, just a place for fuel, sand, exchange crews and minor repairs. Toss in a siding or two and a small yard office. You can selectively compress things and still make a nice place to park and show off your locomotives. Just remember that, like real railroads, you want as few switches coming of your mainline as possible. I am suggesting a single #6 with that comes off your "main" and heads towards the engine facilities and small yard. From there you can make a passing siding and switchback and head back down the layout towards an indursty or two... "Modern" freight tends to mean long unit trains like Intermodels and Autoracks. The industries modern railroads serve tend to want dozens of freight cars of one type at a time, not 1s and 2s. Again though, we'll just have to use selective compression for this... I suggest my favorite modern industry: A plastic manufacturing plant! This one industry will demand covered hoppers of plastic pellets, the occasional tank car of chemicals, a boxcar in of supplies (packaging, paint or other materials, etc...) and boxcars out of finished product. You can represent this all with one or two sidings going up to a large building. I recommend the Pikestuff kits and scratch building a few silos for the plastic pellets. You can even have the building coming out of the backdrop and run a siding into the building for the boxcars (and through the backdrop hidden inside the building if need be). You can scratch-build a simple car-puller at the end of a siding for the hoppers by the silos and a few hoses on the ground for unloading the tank cars. Remember that by bringing in tank cars of chemicals you can also add proper hazmat placement procedures to your operations! It may only be "one industry" but it demands multiple types of freight cars and proper car spotting, making it rather interesting. Good luck!
I would caution against using #4s, especially where they are difficult to access. They have known issues, and I find it just slightly disconcerting that there's a #4 in the dogbone example when a #6 would still work perfectly well at that same point and be more reliable. I'm also puzzled by the claim, "The grid scale on that graphic is 12" and then read, "you will lose about 1 1/2' on each end" when the graphic clearly shows that it's 4' long--about 1' of which can be trimmed--so two of these would eat up a minimum of 6' of linear space, leaving 4' of layout left. Unless you're counting on part of each loop to be "viewable," but surely not very realistic-looking. Or am I missing something...? At the end of the day, if the OP is happy with a switching layout, then there's really no need for loops--they eat up valuable space very quickly. Now, if the OP really wants continuous running, then we have a different kettle of fish, in which case I'd recommend a different approach altogether, one where 11" radius loops won't be a liability, and a transition from country to urban area isn't forced into six linear feet.
Oops, that was a brain fart. I'd been tinkering with plans using a 6" grid and changed it to 12" at the last moment for the picture I was typing 12" and still thinking 6".
Okay, let's start with a clean sheet here. I grew up in the Hudson River Valley. Seeing passenger trains running on the old NYC line going through the tunnel at Breakneck Ridge was a common occurrence. When I moved south to Georgia, my first real trip on my own was taking Amtrak from Atlanta to Chicago. (Crescent from Atlanta to Washington, Capitol Limited from Washington to Chicago, sprung for a sleeper!) So Amtrak has played a part in fond memories, hence my desire for it to have at least a small presence on the layout. Living in Georgia I've been to both the Tennessee Valley Railroad Museum and their Missionary Ridge Local (a few miles from the old station to the turntable and loco restoration shop then back again), as well as the Southeastern Railway Museum here in Georgia, so I'm familiar with the short excursion lines that follow the out and back kind of trip. I like the New York Central but I've been having a heck of a time finding 1930s and 1940s steam in N. The diesels from the '50s like the Alco RS-3 or the PAs were pretty cool, but the big modern GE jobs I see these days working for CSX or the random assortment of NS equipment I hear working away a few miles from my house has appeal too, and it's easier to find. That's where the idea of a loco restoration shop came from - have the modern power for "mainline" activities, and an RS-3 or similar switcher for puttering around. Like I said in my first post, I've been running HO on the floor. My current layout is very similar to the track plan I posted, minus any kind of scenery since it's all on the rug. There are kids in the future, but not right now, so I would like to start working on a quality layout in a room I can lock and keep small hands away from. For me, that's the office, which has an 11' wall and a 4' wall I can get my hands on. Depth is more difficult because it encroaches on the computer desk, the filing cabinets, etc. The first non-oval layout I put together was a Tymesaver, and I had a lot of fun monkeying around with switching cars to various sidings. I think that as far as operating sessions are concerned, having an area for heavy switching would keep the layout in use more than just an oval. The third track plan posted is lightyears beyond anything I could come up with unassisted. But if there's a way to go about jamming all those things together in a better fashion than I first related, I'm happy to learn.
Okay. I can sympathize. I am currently building a N small scale layout on the wall in my office too. So, first thing first, let's talk space! A lot of modelers prefer to be standing when they operate their layouts. So layouts heights tend to be much higher than the average height of a desk. Many people have their modeling workbenches, computers, or workshop equipment and other "man cave" accessories under their layout deck. So you may want to look at some plans for building a layout like that. It doesn't have to be a room filling layout, but it could open up your options for space. Heck, if you did want an around-the walls layout you could even stick with HO.
No, I'm happy to stick with N. And I'm happy to use the third track plan that was posted. I can have CSX servicing the area, and one of the industries can lease an old RS-3 from the loco restoration shop for switching duty. I can swing a small Amtrak consist through once in a blue moon, and be happy.
Glad you like the plan. I modified the third one to use #4 switches on the two crossovers for more realistic mainline spacing. Just be aware that #4s may cause derailments when backing cars over them due to the shape of the points. They can be modified to address this problem if they give you any grief. I also enabled the part numbers on this plan so you can purchase the track you need to build it, if you choose. Good luck, and keep us posted on your progress!
Very cool. Time to start stocking up on track! I'll have to look into modifying the #4 switches when the time comes. Now I need to figure out my industries and start looking at building the shelf/table itself, and learning about DCC.
As I was drawing it, I was envisioning: 1 house 2 passenger station parking 3 shops 4 house 5 small passenger station 6 town 7 switch tower 8 industry (manufacturer? something tall) 9 industry (packing plant? something low) 10 team track loading ramp 11 gas station But, of course, it's your railroad!
This looks pretty cool! Pity you gave up on the Amtrak hopes, I betcha could do something neat there with what you've got. Maybe tweak it a little? You were talking about adding on another four feet for staging, why not dress it up like a big station? Make it part of the layout. Just put your current passenger station on the opposite of whatever end continues to the staging yard.
How's that for a staging yard? I'm not sure I've got enough angle on the tracks leading in for it to bolt up directly to the main layout so that may need some finessing. It would attach to the left of the layout and would be for train storage going on and off the layout.
Lots of problems. Assuming this would be attached to the shelf layout at right angles, the ends of the curves are nowhere near in a position to align with the mainline; you'll need more depth for a ~90 degree turn, and you'll need considerably more length to not only accommodate the rest of the turn, but also tracks that are long enough to store decent trains. Also, you have loads and loads of S-turns that not only create operational troubles, but eat up length as well. Also, I'm not quite sure what the double crossover gets you, since the layout itself has a pair of crossovers. I also think four slightly longer tracks is enough to get you decent ops, as opposed to six stubby ones. Here's a minimal staging yard with enough of a curve to join with the rest of the layout; it measures 20" deep and 5' long.
I decided to attempt building the N scale layout design with my stock of HO track. I'm short a few switches so this is missing a siding or two, but it gets the point across. The first time, to my knowledge, that I have ever made a prototype substantially larger than the end result. Bird's Eye View East end (future warehouse/brewery with one of two sidings built) West end (with passenger station where it would fit for the moment) Warehouse/brewery siding detail (shunting covered hoppers into the brewery?) Next photo is of the main wall of the office where my future empire will be built. And the wall where I can add my 4' to 5' extension However, there has been talk about acquiring the bonus room over the garage for a different location, which would allow the option of a 10' to 11' X 4' table.
Been playing around with the mock-up. For one thing, N or HO, I want to know how to have remotely operated switches. Press a button and have it switch rather than walking/crawling/stretching over and flicking it via finger. That would up my enjoyment immensely. So would a way to remotely uncouple, rather than jab at things with a skewer. Maybe electromagnets under the track in a few choice areas? Shuffling cars around: if I have my grain hoppers come in from the west end of the layout, I have to make a choice to shove it east or couple up front and drag it most of the way before swapping power to the rear. An additional crossover for a run-around loop might be nice, might be unnecessary. Still trying to contemplate the best way to have a fully assembled train come from the staging yard onto the layout and then have the space to take it apart and shunt things where they need to go.
Kato has motors for operating the switches plus there are other products available (such as Tortoise and Blue Point) with motors or manual. Just do a google. For me, the jury is still out on using magnets for uncoupling, I use a Trix skewer.
