ATSF Proposed AT&SF Route over Tehachapi's

For those inquireing minds. A bit of Santa Fe nostalgia.

Disclaimer: I have a lot of respect for those who do their research and point to newspaper articles of days gone by, to prove a point. I learned along time ago not to trust everything you see in print. It is interesting what propaganda you can find there. What I am about to share here comes from family history. I had two great uncles involved in finding a route over the tehachapi's, last name Lightfoot. They worked with the advance survey teams. Going out on location as guides. They used to hunt all over the Tehachapi's and Tejon mountains.

I remember hearing talk about several routes Santa Fe considered in order to build over and through the mountains. In hopes of gaining access into the San Joaquin Valley. When I asked my grandad and uncles about these routes, they got out a map and drew the lines indicating Santa Fe's options. I will attempt to attach a map showing the options. Here is a verbal picture as best I can produce it.

You might want to refrence an article in "the Warbonnet" first quarter issue 2006. pg 13.

A. In Red, is a route that would have come out of Taft and then head up the Grapevine and across to Rosamond.

B. In Red also, is the route that comes out of Bakersfield through Arvin to Rose Station, Wheeler Bridge and then up and over the grapevine and going through to Rosamond. This route is the one discussed in the article in "the Warbonnet" First Quarter issue 2006. I concur.

C. In Green, shows the most likely route. It would have come out of Bakersfield and up what is now Route 223, at a gradient less then the SP. It would have come out from Bakersfield to Arvin, turn east toward the mountian and come out at the junction of ST route 223 and Hwy 58. It would have come out just south of the junction, at an higher elevation above the SP, skirting the mountain just above todays freeway. It would have followed east on what is now State Route 58. Crossing over the SP at Keene, much like todays freeway. Somewhere near the present SP Tehachapi loop would have been an AT&SF loop, located on a hill just northeast of the present loop. As it came into Tehachapi proper, it would have either gone along the South perimeter of the present community or north, above the present SP on the north side of todays freeway. At Mojave it would have continued out across the desert to Boron or North Edwards. On a route, much like the new extension of the freeway that by-passes Mojave.

D. In Blue, a route that would have come out of Bakersfield following Route 223, but veering off to the south and up the face of the mountain coming out somewhere north east of Tejon Pass and back to Mojave and crossover the SP, where the SP/UP wye is today. It is my understanding SP opposed this option vohemently and didn't want a crossover or flyover at Mojave, or anywhere else for that matter.

E. Todays route. To join up with SP and help each other out with mainteance cost over the hill.

Historically, SP fought every move and opposed any crossovers or flyovers of any kind. The court and our state legislature at the time was involved the extent of which is unknown to this author. I am not sure how they arrived at the trackage rights agreement. I would have thought that would be the last thing SP would have wanted. It worked........most of the time.

I can't quite figure out how to attach the map to this thread. Send me an e-mail and I will gladly send it to you. I guess.

[ April 05, 2006, 04:39 PM: Message edited by: BarstowRick ]

 

You got to give me credit for trying. Someone is going to have to share with me how to attach a picture or image.

Thanks in advance.

[ April 02, 2006, 02:36 PM: Message edited by: BarstowRick ]

 

The image has to be viewable by us on a webpage (or by itself) somewhere else. For example, in a railimages account. Is it?

 

I give up! I don't have the foggiest idea on how to post a picture or attachment here. I guess I'l need to take the map to another website. Most have a simple attachment that allows you to access your own documents and pick-up a picture or image. Regretfully, this is over my head.

I've looked for a "Contact Us" access also but unless my eyes are failing me and my brain is going numb...I couldn't find a e-mail address or "contact us" at Trainboard. Oh well!

 

I couldn't help but dive into the article. Just wish I had gotten in on assisting the author with some of the details. Sounds like they had fun writing it.

Good to see a fellow SFRHMS, on board.

 

I too am a member and read all those articles as soon as I got my copy.

I'd be interested in that map Rick. I would offer to host it on my railimages account, but you'd probably find more enjoyment in having your own. And.. you can have one by just asking the moderator of this board.

Russell... what's the Trainboard Santa Fe Frat Pack? new secret society? Is that you, Verne, and :smile:?

 

Thanks for all the advice. Me thinks I can make it work. Just wondering why we had to go and make it so d@#$ed complicated?

If you'd like a copy of the map e-mail me at hpwrick@yahoo.com. I will gladly send you a copy.

Keep in mind the material is highly subjective and has all but stirred up a hornet's nest when I presented it in the past.

From what I heard from my family Santa Fe considered at least five different routes. Possibly more. The most likely choice would be to parallel the SP.

 

Here is Rick's map. I shrunk it a bit due to the file size but it's still quite readable.. Interesting routes, especially to me since I lived in Lancaster for 35 years.

 

A word of appreciation to fitz. Thanks for posting.

Now the fun can start. Let's compare notes and check the research against this model.
For the what it's worth department.

I'd be interested in what John Sweetster might be able to add to this dicussion.

[ April 06, 2006, 01:36 PM: Message edited by: BarstowRick ]

 

Rick and Fitz:

Thanks for all that info. I appreciate it.

Stay cool and run steam....

 

Found it!

I now have a Rail Images Account. You may find it by doing a search for Rick Howland or go to page 35 the last one on the roster. Story of my life...grin! The pictures aren't spectacular perhaps more informative.

I hope this works. The picture I have attached was said by my grandad, "It was a work train I was the hogger (engineer) out of Barstow to clean-up ties recently left by crews removing track from a by-pass" that would have run to the north east of Mojave, CA.

The picture is mine and it comes from family archives. I would appreciate it if you wouldn't use the picture posted here.

Congradulations to the administrative types here at TrainBoard. I find the new format easier to use.

 

Response to Boxcab

I did hear reasons stated as to why certain routes were excluded. Here is one: With regard to the "B" route up and over the grapevine and Tejon Mountain, was the difficulty with the wind and the addition of about one and half to two hours of extra travel time. I believe Santa Fe did go public with the selection of this route in hopes of throwing off the SP. That didn't work as SP had nose sniffers out talking to the ranchers in and around Tehachapi. This, I am told, added pressure to SP to come-up with a resolution.

Here's a tease, I did hear something about "Horse Thief Canyon". Later...

I am waiting to hear from others working on the same subject before I do a tell all here. Thanks for the interest.

 

Speculation can be fun!

Yes, and put that with stories you may have heard and go at it like the nightly CSI TV shows and it can be loads of fun.

However, my intent was to share some history based on how I heard it. I do speculate or hypothesize and perhaps it would be better to allow you to come to your own conclusion. Just my two cents...anyway. >

Horse Thief Canyon? The Native American side of my family did not want Santa Fe to build through Horse Thief Canyon. A canyon just south of Tehachapi. Something about the area is sacred to the Indians. They were thankful when Santa Fe and Southern Pacific agreed to share trackage rights. Just the facts...this time.